Dual boot Linux/Win8 warning

[sunrat]

If you dual boot Windows 8 and Linux, your data may be at risk.

 

The new Fast Startup feature of Windows 8 puts the filesystem's integrity at risk if other operating systems are used to write to Windows partitions. Data loss is particularly likely with dual-boot configurations that involve Linux and Windows 8.

 

http://www.h-online.com/open/features/Linux-and-Windows-8-Fast-Startup-puts-data-at-risk-1780640.html

[V.T. Eric Layton]

I doubt I will ever be dual booting anything with Win 8 on any of my systems. Plus, I NEVER access Windows (any version) from my Linux operating systems. I prefer to use common storage partitions.

 

Good info, though. Thanks Roger.

[sunrat]

thanks for the article, sunrat!

You're welcome. Love your new sig, the first bit anyway!

[lewmur]

If you dual boot Windows 8 and Linux, your data may be at risk.

 

 

 

http://www.h-online....sk-1780640.html

Typical MS attitude. Since Win 8 *assumes* it exists as the only OS a box can boot, it feels free "Fast Boot" without checking to see if the file system has been written to since it last shutdown. Another case of a Windows bug that MS makes others fix.

[réjean]

Like sunrat and Temmu I like Siduction but wait I like Manjaro and darn I also find PCLinuxOS KDE 4 a so cool. And what about Slackware and I shouldn't forget OpenSUSE and CentOS. How long can a day be?

Edited January 25, 2013 by réjean

[goretsky]

Hello,

 

My guess would be that Microsoft was interested in improving the startup time of Windows 8. The percentage of customers who dual-boot both Microsoft Windows 8 and Linux is probably quite small.

 

Regards,

 

Aryeh Goretsky

 

Typical MS attitude. Since Win 8 *assumes* it exists as the only OS a box can boot, it feels free "Fast Boot" without checking to see if the file system has been written to since it last shutdown. Another case of a Windows bug that MS makes others fix.

[lewmur]

Hello,

 

My guess would be that Microsoft was interested in improving the startup time of Windows 8. The percentage of customers who dual-boot both Microsoft Windows 8 and Linux is probably quite small.

 

Regards,

 

Aryeh Goretsky

It doesn't have to be Linux. Dual booting *any* other OS can corrupt the Win 8 partition. Of course, to you, any MS bug is a feature.

[goretsky]

Hello,

 

Not really; I have had my share of bugs that I have reported to or worked with Microsoft on; and I can assure you it is pretty frustrating when you have come across a bug that affects every single user of your product on a given version of Windows. I'm not, however, going to assume that Microsoft is some kind of bogeyman, though; just because there's a potential interoperability issue does not mean that Microsoft is going out of its way to attack computer users who dual-boot their systems, which seems to be what's being alleged.

 

Regards,

 

Aryeh Goretsky

 

It doesn't have to be Linux. Dual booting *any* other OS can corrupt the Win 8 partition. Of course, to you, any MS bug is a feature.

[sunrat]

I doubt MS did this to annoy users of other OS. I read a newsletter recently (Windows Secrets maybe?) where it turns out Fast Boot actually causes some inconveniences to Windows users as well.

[crp]

Hello,

 

Not really; I have had my share of bugs that I have reported to or worked with Microsoft on; and I can assure you it is pretty frustrating when you have come across a bug that affects every single user of your product on a given version of Windows. I'm not, however, going to assume that Microsoft is some kind of bogeyman, though; just because there's a potential interoperability issue does not mean that Microsoft is going out of its way to attack computer users who dual-boot their systems, which seems to be what's being alleged.

 

Regards,

 

Aryeh Goretsky

ahh, but don't forget their old motto " it ain't done till 123 won't run "

Do even 1% of Windows7 users dual-boot? I doubt dual-boot was as much consideration in Windows8 development.

[Guest LilBambi]

To avoid data loss and filesystem inconsistencies, users who run Windows 8 and Linux on the same computer should disable the Fast Startup feature that was introduced with Windows 8 and is active by default. The Fast Startup feature creates an issue because it doesn't shut Windows 8 down completely but switches it to a special hibernation state instead – although it looks like it has been freshly booted when switched back on because all applications have been closed.

 

So, Fast Startup should be disabled if dual-booting to any other OS, not just Linux.

 

I am wonderingabout a full Windows PC running Windows 8 - is leaving Fast Startup enabled is a wise move anyway? Sure nice to have quick boot time, but...

 

Might be fine for a limited RT device, but full Windows system? Not sure it's a wise thing in the long run.

 

Sure it makes startup quicker, but at what cost down the road. You don't get a clean reboot or shutdown. What about malware removal?

 

Can one do a true shutdown even with Fast Startup enabled?

Edited January 28, 2013 by LilBambi

[Guest LilBambi]

Prevention

 

Those who frequently use both operating systems are advised to disable the Windows 8 Fast Startup feature. For this purpose, open the Control Panel and access the "Choose what the power button does" link under Power Options. Click on "Change settings that are currently unavailable"; this will reveal a panel with further options where you can uncheck "Turn on fast startup". Without the Fast Startup feature, Windows 8 will require slightly longer to start. The full Hibernate state that can be enabled on the same panel should be left unchecked, as Windows 8 appears to keep information on the state of all mounted filesystems in memory with this option as well.

[therock247uk]

im not really a fan of windows 8;s bootloader you cant even get into safe mode.

[V.T. Eric Layton]

I'm a Win 7 - Linux dual booter on my laptop. I multi-boot Win XP with numerous Linuxes on my main system.

 

The reality at Redmond is that they don't spend 10 nano-seconds a year thinking about Linux users out here in the wild. All of us together don't account for 1% of MS Windows users in the world.

 

Now MS might be a little nervous about Apple, but who in their right mind dual boots Win and Mac?

[lewmur]

I'm a Win 7 - Linux dual booter on my laptop. I multi-boot Win XP with numerous Linuxes on my main system.

 

The reality at Redmond is that they don't spend 10 nano-seconds a year thinking about Linux users out here in the wild. All of us together don't account for 1% of MS Windows users in the world.

 

Now MS might be a little nervous about Apple, but who in their right mind dual boots Win and Mac?

If you read my earlier post you find that I don't attribute this bug to any malicious intent of MS's part to inhibit dual-booting Linux. Rather, I attribute it to arrogance. Not only don't the give a D***** about Linux user, but they really don't care about hurting their own users. And I think that attitude is going to be their downfall.

 

While I think your 1% figure is very low, the *current* use of desktop Linux isn't the problem.. The problem is that they are losing their death grip on the market. While they still hold close to a monopoly on the desktop market, the desktop itself is losing by leaps and bounds to phones and tablets. Add to that Google coming out with the Chromebook and Ubuntu coming out with a phone and all of a sudden the entire market gets murky.

 

Once people become accustomed to using non-Windows OSes on their phones and tablets, it will become much, much easier to have them do the same thing on their desktop boxes.

[Guest LilBambi]

Please, keep on topic!!! DO NOT attack others for their opinions. Period.

 

Or this topic will be closed.

 

Thank you.

 

Carry on...

 

EDIT: posts with personal attack (and quotes thereof) removed

Edited January 31, 2013 by LilBambi

[goretsky]

Hello,

 

Disabling hibernation will disable Fast Startup on a computer running Microsoft Windows 8, causing it to perform a complete shutdown when turned off.

 

To do so, open an elevated Command Prompt (filename: CMD.EXE) and issue the following command "powercfg.exe /h off" and then close the Command Prompt.

 

Regards,

 

Aryeh Goretsky

 

[Guest LilBambi]

You can also use the Advanced Power Plan settings (located as a text link below the Basic Power Plan) under the Power Options in the Control Panel.

 

Command line so much faster LOL!

[Corrine]

Once people become accustomed to using non-Windows OSes on their phones and tablets, it will become much, much easier to have them do the same thing on their desktop boxes.

 

You're right about that, particularly with the popularity of tablets on the rise because of the very nature of their portability. Why do many people use Microsoft Operating Systems at home? It is because that is what they use in the office and are familiar with it. So, as people become comfortable with other operating systems, they are more likely to be more accepting of something different.

 

im not really a fan of windows 8;s bootloader you cant even get into safe mode.

 

You need to stay up on the developments by fellow Microsoft MVP's, Rocky. See what Bill Pytlovany added to WinPatrol PLUS for Windows 8: Bits from Bill: Rebooting to Windows 8 Safe Mode

[therock247uk]

ohhh very nice!!

[lewmur]

 

You need to stay up on the developments by fellow Microsoft MVP's, Rocky. See what Bill Pytlovany added to WinPatrol PLUS for Windows 8: Bits from Bill: Rebooting to Windows 8 Safe Mode

Yeah, but I notice this "feature" is not available in the free version of WinPatrol. So you have to pay extra just to be able to repair a corrupted Win 8 install. Edited January 31, 2013 by lewmur

[Corrine]

I get what you're saying, although WinPatrol is how Bill makes a living so it we really can't blame him for including some features in the PLUS version. Some people consider the fast boot "corruption" a feature. Others don't. It is all a matter of opinion or perhaps how they use their PC.

[lewmur]

I get what you're saying, although WinPatrol is how Bill makes a living so it we really can't blame him for including some features in the PLUS version. Some people consider the fast boot "corruption" a feature. Others don't. It is all a matter of opinion or perhaps how they use their PC.

I'm not blaming Bill in the least. I'm blaming MS for not including the ability in the first place.iop

 

How can disk corruption be considered a "feature"?

Edited January 31, 2013 by lewmur

[Neil P]

I'm dual booting Windows 8 and Linux right now. I had no idea "fast boot" was an option. I should probably turn that off...

[Guest LilBambi]

Yes, it's great that Bill included that! And I do agree with lewmur that Microsoft should have included that with Windows 8. That was in my opinion a major misstep by Microsoft.

[Neil P]

If the problem with "fast boot" is hibernation, does that mean picking "hibernate" when you shut down is/has always been a problem? Or is it a new wrinkle with Windows 8 specifically

[therock247uk]

hmm i wonder that to

[securitybreach]

hmm i wonder that to

 

Same here....

[Guest LilBambi]

I never used the flaky hibernation on any Windows computers, dual boot or not, so I don't know.

[lewmur]

If the problem with "fast boot" is hibernation, does that mean picking "hibernate" when you shut down is/has always been a problem? Or is it a new wrinkle with Windows 8 specifically

Hibernation doesn't necessarily mean leaving files open. That's the problem with the current Win 8. The reason you aren't supposed to just turn off the power to shut down is that there may be files left open without EOF markers and that can cause disk corruption. Apparently "Fast Boot" records the current state of files but doesn't actually close them. No problem if you reboot and the OS knows the state of the files. But if you boot another OS and write to the partition, the write doesn't know the files are still open and can over-wright their file space. Edited February 2, 2013 by lewmur