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The Software Hall of Shame!


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#101 OFFLINE   cybernut

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Posted 01 June 2003 - 10:56 AM

mrainey, on May 31 2003, 02:31 PM, said:

My nominee for least-compatible, most likely not to work, and most likely to screw up other applications or even totally trash a system is - Adaptec Easy CDCreator - at least through v5.x, at which point I gave up.  I know from talking with friends and reading lots of forum traffic that I am not alone.
Hmmm....I don't use it all that often, but I have Adeptec Easy CDCreator 4 on my Windows 98se computer--it came with it--and I've not had any problems using it (knock on wood  B) ).  Perhaps if I used it more I'd encounter problems, but I've been happy with it in copying about 20 CDs.Cybernut

#102 OFFLINE   basx

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Posted 01 June 2003 - 11:22 AM

Jbred:I can understand your point. However, many of  us are fed up with perpetually changing Office file formats.  we're fed up with document formatting that get messed up due to printer metrics and who like cross platform compatibility.I myself don't use Office and I avoid its file formats as much as possible. HTML is fine but with the amout of proprietary tags that Netscape and MS have added in the past has broken the standard. Web site creaters are particularly loathsome when they just code for Internet Explorer. Lillbambi:Yeay I hate it too when I click on a link and Acrobat loads. It's disrespectful on the part of the web site creators; at least ask me so I can choose.xavier

#103 OFFLINE   Wacky Packs

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Posted 01 June 2003 - 02:59 PM

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Forte Agent Newsreader is a very good program but is a memory hog and, at least for me, runs inadequately on XP.
Funny, I remember running Agent 1.X on a 486SX2-50@66 with 20MB of RAM.  You have to understand that this system took 3-5 minutes to load Eudora 4 or Netscape 4 and could not even play mp3's, yet it ran Agent pefectly.  Since Agent is still on 1.X, I suspect peformance would not change drastically.  Besides Agent, I bet almost none of today's winsock applications would even load on the old computer.

#104 OFFLINE   Cluttermagnet

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Posted 02 June 2003 - 04:37 AM

basx, on May 31 2003, 10:42 AM, said:

To get back to the hall of shame: REDMON- definitely one of the most computer unfriendly programs ever devised. Creating PDF files with free software shouldn't be an epic in proving your inner geekness. I just want to produce PDF documents from any Windows program   :D  :P xavier
Hi, basx- I'm intrigued by your comment about Redmon. From what little I know about it, this freeware is a 'redirector'. I know little else about it because, although I use it regularly, that use is only indirect, under the direction of FreePDF. I have written about FreePDF a couple of times in this forum, including, just recently, here.Are you talking about experiences you had trying to use the program directly? If you were using it indirectly under FreePDF, you would probably not have formed any opinion about it (?) It works just about invisibly for me, along with Alladin Ghostscript. The trio works just flawlessly for me after an admittedly geeky setup ordeal, but it was just not that difficult to set up FreePDF. Once that is done, the whole thing becomes a near-invisible, friendly pseudo-printer that cranks out pdf's of anything you can show in a windows utility that has access to the Print command. What's not to like? You mean you were trying to actually drive Redmon yourself?     :P

#105 OFFLINE   Cluttermagnet

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Posted 02 June 2003 - 04:50 AM

Wacky Packs, on Jun 1 2003, 01:59 PM, said:

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Forte Agent Newsreader is a very good program but is a memory hog and, at least for me, runs inadequately on XP.
Funny, I remember running Agent 1.X on a 486SX2-50@66 with 20MB of RAM.  You have to understand that this system took 3-5 minutes to load Eudora 4 or Netscape 4 and could not even play mp3's, yet it ran Agent pefectly.  Since Agent is still on 1.X, I suspect peformance would not change drastically.  Besides Agent, I bet almost none of today's winsock applications would even load on the old computer.
I have used FreeAgent on Win95 (486-66, 20M RAM) and Win98 platforms. Never had much trouble at all with it. I like it a lot. An exemplary piece of freeware, as I see it. As to memory hogging, I just now tried firing it up and shutting back down a few times. It seems to consume about 5 percent of resources, and I have never noted any tendency for it to leak memory. I have been using an older copy, however- mine says 1.21/32. Maybe there are later versions that fail to please.It takes a few seconds to open, even on my 1.6GHz P4 machine, but not so long that I have any real complaints. As I remember, it opened reasonanbly fast on my 486, which also took a good long time to load Netscape 4.5.  :D

#106 OFFLINE   Cluttermagnet

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Posted 02 June 2003 - 05:13 AM

cybernut, on Jun 1 2003, 09:56 AM, said:

mrainey, on May 31 2003, 02:31 PM, said:

My nominee for least-compatible, most likely not to work, and most likely to screw up other applications or even totally trash a system is - Adaptec Easy CDCreator - at least through v5.x, at which point I gave up.  I know from talking with friends and reading lots of forum traffic that I am not alone.
Hmmm....I don't use it all that often, but I have Adeptec Easy CDCreator 4 on my Windows 98se computer--it came with it--and I've not had any problems using it (knock on wood  :D ).  Perhaps if I used it more I'd encounter problems, but I've been happy with it in copying about 20 CDs.Cybernut
I have an older version Adaptec CD Creator 3.5. It has worked 'OK' on P2 and P4 Win98SE machines. It came bundled with my Iomega ZipCD 650 external USB CD drive. It rarely produced coasters, perhaps once or twice out of many uses. I have no idea if it is 'shameware' or not. (Hey, Scot- I just coined a new term. Use it as you see fit). You guys decide. Obviously, Nero in many different versions is always better/faster, and I now use Nero almost 100 Percent.Hmmm, "Scot's Gallery of Shameware". That has a kind of jazzy, downbeat sort of ring to it.  "Bad shameware- Bad! Bad!" Where's my rolled up newspaper?  :P

#107 OFFLINE   cybernut

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Posted 02 June 2003 - 08:56 AM

Cluttermagnet, on Jun 2 2003, 03:50 AM, said:

I have used FreeAgent on Win95 (486-66, 20M RAM) and Win98 platforms. Never had much trouble at all with it. I like it a lot. An exemplary piece of freeware, as I see it.
I've been trying out Agent, but even Agent can't handle secure news servers by itself.  You've got to install another program called Stunnel, which runs in an DOS screen, and serves as a kind of proxy server.  A royal PIA.  Stunnel comes with next to no instructions that a non-geek can understand.  I've found some minimal instructions on the Web, and they enabled me to get Agent up and running, but the idea of having to run a second program just to access secure news servers seems a bit strange.  I wish that, at least in the commercial version, Agent would built in support for SSL.  I mean, browsers do, so why not Agent?  I like the UI a lot better in Agent than in Netscape, so I may stay with it, but the Stunnel stuff makes me uneasy.  Anyone know a really good newsreader that has SSL built in?Cybernut

#108 OFFLINE   Prelude76

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Posted 02 June 2003 - 12:23 PM

Cluttermagnet, on Jun 2 2003, 04:13 AM, said:

I have an older version Adaptec CD Creator 3.5. It has worked 'OK' on P2 and P4 Win98SE machines. It came bundled with my Iomega ZipCD 650 external USB CD drive. It rarely produced coasters, perhaps once or twice out of many uses. I have no idea if it is 'shameware' or not.
nice term:  shameware  ;) as for EZ Coaster Creator, there was an 'issue' in all versions, even v5 for XP.  for some reasons, 80 minute CDs can only be burned at half speed of your burner as opposed to 74 minute CDs.  EZ Coaster made so many 80minute coasters until i slowed down the burning speed manually to at least less than half.  first time i used neroburn, (v4 i believe), it automatically slows down your speed so chance of making a coaster are almost nil.  also, while i was busy making audio CDs using Nero's on-the-fly MP3 converting, everyone who had EZ Creator back then was busing converting all MP3s to monstreous .WAV files first before being able to record them.  and also, EZ creator's CD copying skills when it came to copy-protected games was pathetic and was successful only about 20% of time.  nero burn always did very good copies, with 90% success (some of the trickier copy-protections out there need Clone CD or BurnWrite, i noticed.)mind you i'm comparing mostly pre v5 versions of EZ Coaster Creator, as their v5 XP version was a horrendous disaster that screwed up many XP installations in the beginning.  i think that was the straw that broke Roxio's back.  plus the fact it loads over 60mb of bloat just to burn CDs!!!  Nero's an anerexic beauty when their sizes are compared.side note:  does anyone actually use ruined CDs as coaster?  just a thought.  B)

#109 OFFLINE   GolfProRM

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Posted 02 June 2003 - 12:34 PM

Prelude76, on Jun 2 2003, 11:23 AM, said:

side note:  does anyone actually use ruined CDs as coaster?  just a thought.  B)
Actually, I do! ;)  Although I always "nuke" them in the Microwave for about 3 seconds first... makes a pretty pattern :DThen glue them onto a thin layer of corkboard (keeping the label side down)...  Make decent coasters I guess...  still prefer the stone ones though...

#110 OFFLINE   BurBunny

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Posted 02 June 2003 - 01:39 PM

Count me among the number who registered just to ask that PSP be removed from the Hall of Shame list.I started with PSP5.  I'll admit, it was a not-quite-legal copy a then-boyfriend installed on my computer.  But I liked it so much that when I purchased a new computer, I purchased PSP7 and am still using it.  I preferred the older UI, but I can deal with 7.  I'm the type of user who putzes around in a program until I figure out how something works, or learns it only when I need it.  So far, the only thing that PSP hasn't been able to do that Photoshop handles easily was change a RGB color to a CMYK and then adjust the color balance of that CMYK for printing purposes (the direct association color wasn't an exact color match), but for that I'll pay for time on a Kinko's computer to do the adjustments.Would I like the full Adobe Photoshop?  Sure!  Am I willing to pay that much for it?  Not on your life!  I don't have need for that much functionality, especially at 8 times the cost.Now that Elements is released, I might take a look at it.  I'd love to talk with people who have used both PSP and Elements and compare those two programs.  To compare PSP to Photoshop isn't apples to apples.  To put PSP in a Hall of Shame because it doesn't live up to Photoshop?  Unfair.  Compare PSP to Elements then get back to me on whether either belong in a Hall of Shame.Amber

#111 OFFLINE   doctormidnight

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Posted 02 June 2003 - 07:46 PM

I can't remember the name right now, but Sony puts out CD recording software with their burners (I have a 48x24x48 Sony burner), and all it did was reboot both of my main machines. I think its like B's Recorder or some "we want to sound hip, so let's use "B" and try to make people think we had something to do with Half Baked, yo!"I haven't ever had a prob with Outlook being a "memory hog" as one person put it.. but I have a GB of RAM and a partition just for my swap file ;)Corel 11 crashed continuously for about a month... then I switched video cards and it stopped, but I know a lot of people that have had probs with it (like ChrisP). Oh, and anything that is even remotely associate with RealNetworks... even "Real Cheese" comes close.MSI KT3 Ultra ARUAthlon XP2000+ Tbred @ 1.88 Ghz1 GB Crucial PC2700 DDRVolcano 9FIC Radeon 9700 (w/modded BIOS 361/309)2 x 40 GB ATA133 HDs1 x 80 GB ATA133 HDSony 48x24x48 BurnerToshiba DVD-ROMEnermax 550 Watt PSUTurtle Beach Santa CruzViewSonic P95f+Logitech Z340'sKensington MIB Optical ProXP/Mandrake 9.1/Longhorn Milestone 5

#112 OFFLINE   LilBambi

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Posted 03 June 2003 - 03:01 PM

We've used ruined (not too many actually with Nero) CDRs as coasters. We also use the AOL, Compuserve, etc. CDs the same way.We usually just crazy glue a couple of them together to weight them down a bit and voila.
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#113 OFFLINE   Temmu

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Posted 03 June 2003 - 06:49 PM

.pdf - yeth, large, larger and largest.  using pdf creator from word (especially if doc has pix) does not necc. produce the same document.  and printing a .pdf - yeah, it can be tweaked to print .pdf page for printed page, but sometimes the IT guy (um, that would be me...) has to go to the user's desk an tweak the fire out of printer settings.psp v7 - um, methinks i have that version and it does ok - but - i'll have to go to one of my machines and see...AOL otherwise known as AO-**** - v4 was stable (for AOL, that is) but does not work with ie v5 and up (methinks).  v5 crashed 50% of the PC's out there -  so much so that there was a class action lawsuit.  v6 was not any better.  v7 stabilized somewhat (kinda like an airplane missing a piece of its wing could be said to stabilize...) v8 sucketh and is sloweth.virus-like programs - norton utilities began vigorously inhaling (think suction) somewhere around windows 95 or 98 (i loved norton's stuff before then, the hex editor, recovery utils, etc.) the built-in windows utilities are close but no cigar - they lack a full feature set or only partially do the job - defrag sorta does, cd burner only does so much, etc. any program written in visual anything is bloatware.  programmers should write only in c or machine code. and speaking of bloatware, windows needs to be vastly pared down, with MILLIONS of lines of UNUSED code that has NEVER been edited out. (and that info from microsoft.)editor: ok, ok, enough already...  B) [temmu goes back to polishing his land speeder]
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#114 OFFLINE   Cluttermagnet

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Posted 03 June 2003 - 11:02 PM

LilBambi, on Jun 3 2003, 02:01 PM, said:

We've used ruined (not too many actually with Nero) CDRs as coasters. We also use the AOL, Compuserve, etc. CDs the same way.We usually just crazy glue a couple of them together to weight them down a bit and voila.
If used as coasters, won't they let condensate drip through the spindle holes and stain your tabletop anyway? Maybe you could glue together a sandwich with plastic sheet in the middle. I can picture them being used as 'clay pigeons' to be blown apart in midair by shotgun blasts.  B) I saw an article that suggested they could be sewn onto survival vests, shiny side out, to make a good rescue signal visible from an aircraft. If I knew someone who had a 'launcher' that could fire off magazines of 100 of more AOL CDs rapid fire, I would not want to get on their 'bad side'.  B) Reminds me of the 'Odd Job' character in the 007 movie.   B)

#115 OFFLINE   wrecklass

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Posted 04 June 2003 - 07:14 PM

Heh, I think the consensus seems to be that the Software Hall of Shame should simply start withimport com.Microsoft.*;Oops, giving away my identity again.

#116 OFFLINE   Temmu

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Posted 05 June 2003 - 07:38 PM

ms.they're huge.they're what big (and small) business uses.i don't care for the fact that they spend more time on glitz than speed / smooth but at least they finally got stable.no one else has the money to devote to writing and testing code at their level.i just wish they'd shrink itand test their patches / service packs before foisting them on us.
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#117 OFFLINE   GeeWhizBang

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Posted 08 June 2003 - 11:56 AM

Microsoft WordMicrosoft PublisherGatorWindows MEReal PlayerAlexaMicrosoft Word is right there at #1 because it is so popular, but such a lousy program. I am currently using it at work for technical documents, and it is really infuriating because.1. It is basically impossible to create a single template stylesheet and use it for all the documents. Somehow, Microsoft has made gradual changes over the years to the template feature to make it basically impossible to create a single template, save a style change in that template and have it reliably update all of the attached documents.2. Autonumbering. Autonumbering is still the worst-implemented feature in Word. Sometimes, no matter what you do with numbered lists, it refuses to restart numbering at 1, or it will restart the numbering even when you don't want it to do it. Sometimes, you have to screw up EVERY numbered item in the whole document in order to fix the problem.3. Related to number 2, but a separate problem in its own right is the problems of paragraph indents being stored in TWO places for autonumbered items. One is in the paragraph attributes for the tag, and the other is (quite unnecessarily) stored in the autonumbering setup.4. Built-in screwed up style tags you can't delete. Why is this useful?5. No keep with previous setting for paragraphs.6. A forced page break causes the next item (usually a heading, of course) to have space above that is larger than when it appears normally.7. Lack of automatic on-the-fly hyphenation.8. Lack of ability to write a key-trapped macro that finds something, extends the selection to the next thing you find, and performs actions with the resulting selected text. WordPerfect has always had this ability. A related issue is the difficulty of search for beginning and ending formatting codes just like Word Perfect.9. Can we be allowed to set a  tab dot leader density, since having every position dotted looks tacky?10. Why are all of the default settings for numbered lists LEFT justified rather than right-justified.I could go on and on and on in an endless pattern of silly decisions that constantly clog my time and force compromises in the layout. Mostly, I have not complained about the interface; the interface for Word finally works very well, but some of the underlying metaphors have been unchanged since the very first version and are still just as wrong now as they ever were.

#118 OFFLINE   mikeh

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Posted 08 June 2003 - 02:28 PM

Griping about software (and hardware and web sites) has been my hobby for the last few years. See www.computergripes.comMichael

#119 OFFLINE   LilBambi

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Posted 08 June 2003 - 03:27 PM

Very nice mikeh ... I am reading some of it now ... bookmarked :P
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#120 OFFLINE   Temmu

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Posted 10 June 2003 - 09:14 AM

mikeh:  nice.  wish you'd post the defensive computer course outline/notes!
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#121 OFFLINE   GolfProRM

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Posted 17 June 2003 - 03:56 PM

Alrighty...  Time to get this thread fired back up again!Scot's new list of nominees need some work... :)I don't really think the Palm Desktop Software really belongs on the shameware list...  The newest version (available from http://www.palm.com ) is actually quite a step up in quality.  They added a very nice quick installer, and fixed a lot of the WinXP issues that occurred in the previous versions...  It definitely isn't the greatest software out there, but it's definitely not shameware material...

#122 OFFLINE   CACasal

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Posted 17 June 2003 - 04:14 PM

I see that Incredimail has been tentatively put on the list for the Software Hall of Shame. <_< Incredimail...though it gobbles up space, is a fun mail program to use. It does a great job of doing what it proposes to do. Yes...it could be called a frivilous program...maybe even useless...but then it's fun....the kids love it, and frankly, so do I.CACasal.

#123 OFFLINE   dbchamber

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Posted 17 June 2003 - 04:35 PM

Intuit Turbotax should come OFF the list.  They have dropped the horrible product activation.  I will go back to them next year because the program is much better than H&R Block's TaxCut.  I see no reason why Delorme's Street Atlas should be on the list.  I use it several times a week on my desktop and my laptop and find that it does everything that I need and does it well.Dave Chamberlain

#124 OFFLINE   pknudsen

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Posted 17 June 2003 - 04:39 PM

First, shame on whoever nominated Agent!  It's a fine newsreader, and does everything I need.Second, what's the problem with Real Player?  Works ok for me.(edit)  Come to think of it, why can't this forum be available in newsgroup format?  It works much better than web.  (Or is it?)

Edited by pknudsen, 17 June 2003 - 04:41 PM.


#125 OFFLINE   stanrich

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Posted 17 June 2003 - 04:45 PM

Roxio is listed as Shameware in the SFNL email I just read.  however, I have installed the 5.yadda.basic version plus the 5.3.5.10 patch and have experienced absolutely no problems on either WIN98 or WIN2K systems.  These were clean installs.It should be noted that I do a custom install and I NEVER install Direct CD...




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