Tushman Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 (edited) I had a job interview today and part of the interview involved talking with their lead tech. He set up a mock scenario where a office user couldn't connect their laptop (wirelessly) to their access point. He had me remote into his laptop and pretend that I was the full-time tech on-site and asked how I would go about fixing this problem.First I did the basic/routine steps:Run, cmd. ipconfig /all; ipconfig /flushdns; ipconfig /release; ipconfig /renew. Notta.Rebooted the system. Still couldn't connect wirelessly.Checked msconfig. Everything seemed fine there.I had a sneaky suspicion that he might have disabled Windows Wireless Zero config service was disabled.Run, services.mscIn the services console, it showed that the zero config service was set to "automatic". But here's the real kicker. The service was not running! How did I know this? On Microsoft's website, i found a command line that you can use to tell if it's running or not. Real simple.sc query wzcsvcIf it's running, it should display: "STATE : # RUNNING"During my test, it showed STOPPED. So that's how I knew it wasn't running.So I went back to the services console, right clicked on the service in question and told it to start. And BAM, he was up & running again.I've never seen anything like that before. Even though the system had the service to be running automatically, it was stopped. Short of a user action purposely stopping the service, what would cause something like that to happen?Maybe a 3rd party wireless configuration manager (software). Who's got some ideas? Edited April 25, 2011 by Tushman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corrine Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 Good detective work! Probably a bad or incompatible driver. Although for Windows XP SP2, see How to troubleshoot wireless network connections in Windows XP Service Pack 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V.T. Eric Layton Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 HA! I would have had the office user install Slackware and wicd to access the Network. I guess I wouldn't have gotten that job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tushman Posted April 26, 2011 Author Share Posted April 26, 2011 (edited) HA! I would have had the office user install Slackware and wicd to access the Network. I guess I wouldn't have gotten that job. Well I'm not sure if I have the offer just yet. They want someone on a temporary basis only with a marginal promise of keeping them long term if things work out. It's a big IT outsourcing company and they said they have lots of things happening. We'll see... right now their main concern is whether I would be challenged enough to stay on the job - it's only level 1 tech support. I told them I would gladly accept an offer regardless - it sure beats working at 7-11 selling Slurpies. Edited April 26, 2011 by Tushman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V.T. Eric Layton Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 Best of LUCK, man! I know wherefore you cometh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tushman Posted April 26, 2011 Author Share Posted April 26, 2011 Best of LUCK, man! I know wherefore you cometh. Thanks Eric - I'll let you know how it goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zlim Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 Good luck, Tushman. At least you'd be a Level 1 support person who understands English AND can troubleshoot things outside of a script. If you get the job, my hope is they do not force you to fix things in minutes sticking to a script. Some problems take time and companies need to realize that a quick scripted fix that only half works leaves the tech person and the customer frustrated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corrine Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 Ditto what plodr said! Fingers crossed for you, Tushman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tushman Posted April 26, 2011 Author Share Posted April 26, 2011 (edited) Good luck, Tushman. At least you'd be a Level 1 support person who understands English AND can troubleshoot things outside of a script. If you get the job, my hope is they do not force you to fix things in minutes sticking to a script. Some problems take time and companies need to realize that a quick scripted fix that only half works leaves the tech person and the customer frustrated.Thanks Liz. By the sounds of it, I think this job is going to be more hands-on stuff rather than sitting behind a desk and taking help desk calls. I'm still a little bit unclear of what's going to entail actually. The hiring manager that I interviewed with initially said it was more like level 2 or 3 tech support. But I had a phone interview with another manager in the company who said it's really level 1. Some of the things they talked about like setting up new work stations and troubleshooting printer problems seemed like to be it's sort of a field tech position mixed in with some basic user support. I hoping to get some more clarification today or tomorrow.I do agree with you about having to deal with tech support personnel sticking to a canned script. That can't be helped due to low requirements that's been set for people in that position. I really wish it weren't so. If I ruled the world, all help desk employees would be proficient in English & have some basic computer smarts about them. Also all those IT jobs that were lost to India & the Philippines aren't coming back. Thanks to George Dubya - corporations got big tax breaks/incentives for shipping those jobs overseas. That is NOT gonna change anytime soon. :(Edit: Oops, just saw your post Corrine. Thanks. Edited April 27, 2011 by Tushman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b2cm Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 (edited) The only explanation to that is the lead tech stopped the service (My Computer>Manage>Service and Application>Services>Wireless Zero Configuration---rightclick, select Stop).A wireless utility, if installed, will prevent that service from starting. And if you started the service, you will be get a notice about that utility. You would need to disable or uninstall that utility if you want Windows to manage your wireless connectivity. If you did not get that notice and the service started, that means there are no 3rd party wireless utility installed and running. Also, if there is something wrong with services (RPC) or drivers (ndisuio) the Wireless Zero Config service is dependent on, you will not be able to start that service. The fact that you were able to start the serice and get wireless connectivity means that someone just manually stopped the service.Yep, you're right those outsourced jobs aren't coming back. How can you compete with Indians with Computer Science or Engineering degrees willing to be paid, by US standards, insanely low wages? Edited April 27, 2011 by b2cm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tushman Posted April 27, 2011 Author Share Posted April 27, 2011 The only explanation to that is the lead tech stopped the service (My Computer>Manage>Service and Application>Services>Wireless Zero Configuration---rightclick, select Stop).Yep, you're right those outsourced jobs aren't coming back. How can you compete with Indians with Computer Science or Engineering degrees willing to be paid, by US standards, insanely low wages?Yes I know that. Which is why I said in my original post:"Short of a user action purposely stopping the service, what would cause...."Firstly, users going into the services console & manually disabling one specific service doesn't happen often. I checked the depencies as well and they did not seem like they were altered. It really doesn't seem like a likely scenario to happen. To me, it seems like a rather odd test to present to a job candidate. Most basic users don't even know what services are and how to start it.Furthermore, many 3rd party wireless config utilities will give a message (as you've pointed out) that it is running if you try to start the windows zero config service. So.... why would he design a test like that? My best guess is that they wanted to see how a candidate would handle a problem like that to ascertain their thought process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b2cm Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 (edited) So.... why would he design a test like that?To count the number of steps it took you to solve a simple problem. It was a two-step troubleshooting (1-system tray or network connections check for device status and connectivity, 2-computer management console check for wireless connectivity support). Edited April 27, 2011 by b2cm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tushman Posted April 27, 2011 Author Share Posted April 27, 2011 To count the number of steps it took you to solve a simple problem. It was a two-step troubleshooting (1-system tray or network connections check for device status and connectivity, 2-computer management console check for wireless connectivity support).There's really no way for him to have known whether I checked the system tray or not. Their lead tech was at an off site client location and like I said in my post, he had me remote into his laptop. Was he tracking my eyeball movements? I doubt it. So to count exact number of steps in this case is not likely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b2cm Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Was he tracking my eyeball movementsWell, if you were connecting to his laptop remotely he would be able to see your keyboard and mouse events.If the problem is connectivity, you can expect someone with troubleshooting experience to begin the diagnosis by opening Network Connections (in XP, via a right-click on a network device icon in the system tray or the Network Connections item in Control Panel; in Vista/Windows 7, via the 'control netconnections' or 'C:\windows\system32\ncpa.cpl' in Run). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tushman Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 Well, if you were connecting to his laptop remotely he would be able to see your keyboard and mouse events.If the problem is connectivity, you can expect someone with troubleshooting experience to begin the diagnosis by opening Network Connections (in XP, via a right-click on a network device icon in the system tray or the Network Connections item in Control Panel; in Vista/Windows 7, via the 'control netconnections' or 'C:\windows\system32\ncpa.cpl' in Run).Yeah, that's basic stuff that anyone would do even with a modicum of experience would do. My point is that there is really no way for him to have known whether I looked at the system tray or not unless there was hardware/software tracking my eyeball movements. So counting the exact number of steps doesn't seem like a good reason to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChipDoc Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 How can you compete with Indians with Computer Science or Engineering degrees willing to be paid, by US standards, insanely low wages?That's actually pretty straightforward. You make it possible to live decently on those wages. That's the way it was here in the States for generations - you only needed one job to keep a family household running. These days you need more than that and it's caused all sorts of problems with our culture.None of which will be solved by an upgrade patch... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b2cm Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Yeah, that's basic stuff that anyone would do even with a modicum of experience would do.The problem was that 'basic'. My point is that there is really no way for him to have known whether I looked at the system tray or not unless there was hardware/software tracking my eyeball movements.If this was a help center, there probably was a remote assistance session recorder running. So counting the exact number of steps doesn't seem like a good reason to me.It is a good indicator of how systematic and efficient the troubleshooting is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tushman Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 (edited) If this was a help center, there probably was a remote assistance session recorder running.This is not a "help center" - I think I already mentioned that atleast once in this post. As I stated in my previous post, the lead tech was at an offsite client location. Whatever recorder they have I doubt was capable of tracking eyeball movements. I should know - I was sitting in front of their computer and didn't see anything special other than a flat panel monitor and a PC.It is a good indicator of how systematic and efficient the troubleshooting is.Maybe counting the number of steps is a measuring stick that you use. To me that's petty. I've done interviews & hiring before and to say that I'm gong to hire candidate A versus candidate B because the first guy took 5 steps less is shortsighted and simplistic. There's a whole myriad of other factors that go into it. You should try it sometime and see just how difficult it is to hire good techs. Edited April 28, 2011 by Tushman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ross549 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Tushman, you are right... there is a lot more that makes a good tech.However, some companies want someone fast. The fastest tech gets results faster and can take the most trouble tickets. It is simple math, and that is the point I think b2cm was trying to make. ;)Adam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b2cm Posted April 29, 2011 Share Posted April 29, 2011 Why would he track your eyeball movement? If he had a session recorder, a playback would show all your mouse and keyboard events. Those events would show your procedure. Your procedure would indicate your grasp of Windows networking and troubleshooting skills. The more systematic and efficient the procedure the faster a problem is solved. For management, that is higher productivity and a better profit margin. For clients, shorter downtimes also means more productivity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tushman Posted April 29, 2011 Author Share Posted April 29, 2011 (edited) Well I finally heard back from the client and I'll be starting on Monday. It'll put food on the table for the next 3 months and we'll see how goes after that. I'll be continuing my job hunt regardless - this is only a temp opportunity so I gotta keep my eyes peeled in case it doesn't work out.Nothing like starting off the weekend with a job offer! Yipeeee. Edited April 29, 2011 by Tushman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zlim Posted April 29, 2011 Share Posted April 29, 2011 Great! Life's no fun without a job. (Eric can attest to that). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChipDoc Posted April 30, 2011 Share Posted April 30, 2011 Congratulations, Tushman! Liz is right, life really isn't much fun without a steady income stream. It'd be great to have the income without the job, but we'll take what we can get!I was without work for three months last year. When I got my current job, I was disappointed that it was only part time. But it turns out that, between a better pay rate and working 12-hour weekend shifts, I'm actually making more money than I was at the last full-time job I had.Admittedly that job set the payscale bar pretty abysmally low... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V.T. Eric Layton Posted April 30, 2011 Share Posted April 30, 2011 Yes. I can attest. :(Best of luck, T-man! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mac Posted April 30, 2011 Share Posted April 30, 2011 Great news Tushman! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corrine Posted April 30, 2011 Share Posted April 30, 2011 Wonderful! Congrats, Tushman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tushman Posted April 30, 2011 Author Share Posted April 30, 2011 Thanks everyone. I'm really looking forward to it. The fact that it's a temporary gig is really not my cup of tea but atleast it will help to pay the bills for a short while. Meanwhile if I can just hit that lotto.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChipDoc Posted May 1, 2011 Share Posted May 1, 2011 I thought Eric had first dibs on the Lotto? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mac Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Congrats on landing the job Tushman! Having a source of income coming in makes life much easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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