why Firefox has a memory problem

[Keegan]

Here the lead developer of Firefox explains the increased memory usage in 1.5:http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/ben/archives/009749.htmlwhile reading it Firefox uses about 240mb, lol

[Neil P]

Here the lead developer of Firefox explains the increased memory usage in 1.5:http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/ben/archives/009749.htmlwhile reading it Firefox uses about 240mb, lol

Well, it is a feature that is causing it. What he's saying, though, is that this isn't a "memory leak". A leak implies the memory was not freed when the browser was done with it. Memory is not leaking in this case, but it is being used up by the bfcache.However, Firefox 1.5 does have leaks, even though he doesn't address them. I think if people would turn of the bfcache their memory usage would go down. They still have quite a few (bfcache) bugs that need work, but they have also fixed quite a few in that tree. Bugs with a line through them are fixed, pressing "Hide Resolved" at the top will show all of the unfixed bugs only.

[Gary]

The problem was fixed with the release of Firefox 1.5.0.1 -If you have not updated I suggest that you do so ASAP.

[havnblast]

It's really sad to see what is happening with FF quality. I know many are dumping it for Opera. I myself have been switching over to Opera even. I don't know what needs to be fixed, but they really need to look at what is important before overhauling the bookmarks. More and more articles and posts are coming out slamming FF quality. Is this going to be another case of the netscape rise and fall? I don't think so myself, but they really need to address the present problems before they loose all that market share they worked so hard to get.

[Gary]

I had 38 tabs open at one time and my memory usage was not as high as 240MB. In fact it was something like 124MB.When someone comes out with the perfect browser please post a link to it. In the meantime I will continue to use the next best thing.

Edited February 16, 2006 by Gary

[Guest LilBambi]

I think it's always good to have a few browsers around. Never know when one will be needed over the other for something. Or want to use something different simply for a change.I like both FF and Opera and use them both too! But FF does render more pages better .. so it is often a matter of what works and still keeps you safer.There are no completely safe browsers...there will always be issues that need fixing. But as Neil stated, they did fix this in 1.5.0.1.And the FF update is easily obtained ... especially since the updates notification is there to let you know about it.

[Keegan]

I think it's always good to have a few browsers around. Never know when one will be needed over the other for something. Or want to use something different simply for a change.I like both FF and Opera and use them both too! But FF does render more pages better .. so it is often a matter of what works and still keeps you safer.There are no completely safe browsers...there will always be issues that need fixing. But as Neil stated, they did fix this in 1.5.0.1.And the FF update is easily obtained ... especially since the updates notification is there to let you know about it.

strange since i am using 1.5.01i haven't noticed any difference in memory usage between 1.5 and 1.5.0.1it doesn't really matter so much since i have 1gig ram, but more important is the attitude the developers are having with the problem, just like Gary i guess the point is there is something wrong like it or not, maybe it will be fixed maybe not, time will telland like gary said it is the best browser regardless these problemsi am also using it on an old laptop with 96 mb ram Edited February 16, 2006 by Keegan

[Grasshopper]

It's really sad to see what is happening with FF quality. I know many are dumping it for Opera. I myself have been switching over to Opera even. I don't know what needs to be fixed, but they really need to look at what is important before overhauling the bookmarks. More and more articles and posts are coming out slamming FF quality. Is this going to be another case of the netscape rise and fall? I don't think so myself, but they really need to address the present problems before they loose all that market share they worked so hard to get.

I don't know if it's that or just a combination of intense coverage (finding a few problems) and people jumping on and off the bandwagon, so to speak. I think that if you really want competition in the browser market, you have to accept the consequences that come with that, i.e. fine tooth comb looking for bugs, arguments, comparisons, flame wars, etc. I think that Fran said right when she mentioned having a few options. I currently only use FF and IE for the IE only pages and a few other broken pages from FF. I may check into Opera sometime, but I don't see a need at this point. I also think that it's the people's browsing habits that bring trouble too. If you occasionally closed your browser and restarted it, that would be a very positive behavior modification on the PEBKAC side of it (memory issues). And to be quite honest, user behavior modification could fix quite a few "bugs" in software (including shady browsing habits leading to viruses, worms, etc). Just my 2 cents.

[Gary]

strange since i am using 1.5.01i haven't noticed any difference in memory usage between 1.5 and 1.5.0.1it doesn't really matter so much since i have 1gig ram, but more important is the attitude the developers are having with the problem, just like Gary i guess the point is there is something wrong like it or not, maybe it will be fixed maybe not, time will telland like gary said it is the best browser regardless these problemsi am also using it on an old laptop with 96 mb ram

If you only have 96 mb of ram how did the following happen?

while reading it Firefox uses about 240mb

Or are you counting disk cache use there as well?I have tried Opera and as far as the Browser goes it is pretty fast. Their web based mail leaves quite allot to be desired though. Slow and full of ads unles you wish to pay $29.95 just to remove the ads.I think that T-Bird is correct. Due to the ad campaign by the Firefox people everyone is putting Firefox under a microscope just looking for possible problems. Edited February 16, 2006 by Gary

[Guest LilBambi]

Opera is a great browser and it is fast!Firefox is a great browser too and does more pages correctly than Opera does.But they are both great browsers.This is not a cross road where you have to choose only one or you go no where. Options are what it's all about. And making sure you use a safer browser for general surfing will keep your OS safer in the long run.So have them both ... they both have their strengths and weakness as do all browsers.And as tbird said, IE is still necessary for a few certain pages that neither one can do properly.... and also if you want to download programs that require you to have WGA checked before the download.I personally don't use the extension that allows FF to use the IE engine for those sites. If I want to use IE, I will open it myself. ;)BTW: If your eyes get glazed and tired occasionally from too much reading, try out Opera's ability to read a page to you! Really nice (10MB download but worth it).

[Keegan]

If you only have 96 mb of ram how did the following happen?Or are you counting disk cache use there as well?That is my second pc, a laptop with a 266 mhz and 96 mb, running win98seFirefox is running ok, but i am thinking about downgrading 2 1.08 or trying 2 disable the option discussed in Bens blogon my main pc i have 1 gig of ram, normally firefox uses from 60 mb up 2 about 160 mb, but like i said there is not a decrease in memory usage from 1.5 2 this new onebut unused ram is wasted ram anyway

[Neil P]

I don't know what needs to be fixed, but they really need to look at what is important before overhauling the bookmarks.

Approximately 10 memory leak bugs have been fixed on the trunk that have not yet been ported to the branch(es). With the new rules to check in code, they've got to go on the trunk and get tested before they can land on a branch. A few of those leaks either won't be fixed on the branch, or can't get checked in because they cause too many other regressions. The new Bookmarks & History system actually fixes a leak in the Autocomplete system, and a few of the 10 fixes will be landing on the branches shortly.Believe me, they're working on the problem of memory leaks, too. Not everyone knows how to fix leaky code, and the ones that do can't devote 100% of their time to it. It is a priority, and it will improve with each release, I can assure you of that. As I've stated before, on two computers running 1.5.0.1, I don't see any abnormal memory usage (Firefox is currently using under 39MB right now, according to the task manager)

[Tushman]

What I find a bit pathetically ridiculous is how some people are jumping on the bandwagon of bashing Firefox for these "memory leaks". The majority of these users represent nothing more than your typical average home user who have no computer/ programming knowledge and yet feel good about bashing FF, just because it's 'fashionable' and every is DOING IT.For those think FF is buggy or lame, they should wake up and smell the coffee. IE has had a track record of bad code such as the notorious buffer overflow, (which took MS atleast a couple of attempts to patch completely) or how some hackers found a way to run malicious ActiveX controls through IE. I'll take FF anyday - memory leak or no memory leak. IE is a bit of a joke in comparison to FF in the plentiful features and how it's developers have continually tried to make it the best browser possible. There's not a single browser out there that is perfect. But IMHO, both FF and Opera are much better alternatives to IE. That's my story and I'm stickin to it!

Edited February 17, 2006 by Tushman

[mrainey]

I'm not a Firefox basher, I use it 99% of the time. When, after an hour or two of heavy use, I see >100 megs of memory being tied up, I have to concede it's pretty greedy.I really like the Live Bookmarks in Firefox.There are some shells available (Maxthon, SlimBrowser, etc) that make IE quite pleasant to use, but somehow lacking in the "look and feel" area.Firefox crashes now and then, IE never does for me.Firefox sometimes throws up a "Page Not Found" error, but usually finds it on the second click. Others have reported this problem. I don't see it with IE.I've never had security issues with either one (to my knowledge). I'm very careful about what I click on and always have a full range of anti-virus, anti-trojan, anti-spyware, and firewall programs running.

[havnblast]

I find FF doesn't know what to do with a lot of php files since version 1.5 +It will pop up and ask me what to open it with and I'm like wth?Like I was saying they need to fix what they have and stop trying to add this or that or change this out completely. It didn't use to have these problems

[epp_b]

Firefox has nothing to do with parsing PHP files. If you are being asked to save PHP files, it's the fault of the a incorrectly configured server.-----------Fortunately, Firefox' memory usage isn't a problem for me with a GB a RAM

[lewmur]

Firefox sometimes throws up a "Page Not Found" error, but usually finds it on the second click. Others have reported this problem. I don't see it with IE.

This one I actually consider a *feature* rather than a bug. IE doesn't do it because IE takes forever and a day to time out. FF's timeout is much shorter and sometimes does cause an error. But, IMHO, that is a *LOT* better than waiting forever when a page isn't available.

[Keegan]

What I find a bit pathetically ridiculous is how some people are jumping on the bandwagon of bashing Firefox for these "memory leaks". The majority of these users represent nothing more than your typical average home user who have no computer/ programming knowledge and yet feel good about bashing FF, just because it's 'fashionable' and every is DOING IT.For those think FF is buggy or lame, they should wake up and smell the coffee. IE has had a track record of bad code such as the notorious buffer overflow, (which took MS atleast a couple of attempts to patch completely) or how some hackers found a way to run malicious ActiveX controls through IE. I'll take FF anyday - memory leak or no memory leak. IE is a bit of a joke in comparison to FF in the plentiful features and how it's developers have continually tried to make it the best browser possible. There's not a single browser out there that is perfect. But IMHO, both FF and Opera are much better alternatives to IE. That's my story and I'm stickin to it!

and what do ie or opera have with memory problems in firefox?please stay on topic and refrain from calling people names in this forum, we are a little more mature than that

[Tushman]

and what do ie or opera have with memory problems in firefox?please stay on topic and refrain from calling people names in this forum, we are a little more mature than that

You're being quite delusional Keegan. Who told you that I called anyone in this thread any names? Get a clue. I never said anything about Opera having memory problems - I dont' appreciate you twising my words around or throwing around trumped up accusations that don't amount to hill of beans.Sounds like you have some thin skin - I would take that kind of attitude elsewhere. Edited February 17, 2006 by Tushman

[Guest LilBambi]

OK, OK...we don't need any of this type of thing.Let's get back on topic here.I personally see Firefox with 24-25MB, second largest user of memory, next to Thunderbird with 43MB memory used (with a huge profile btw) and between Explorer (which runs all the time and related to IE), and IE itself, accounting for about the same amount as Firefox on this XP Pro computer.With several Tabs open it goes up to about 32MB for Firefox. The more tabs, the more memory being used which makes sense.Opera when it opens before any tabs are open at all is running at 35MB.I don't see any real problem with the FF stats here. Course I don't use many extensions either which would up the ante. The stats for FF are with four to five extensions loaded.I would venture to say that all browsers except IE, run with some overhead, mainly because MS can split the resources of IE with Explorer which runs constantly and about half of what IE alone uses.Granted, there may be problems with memory in FF in certain situations, but I haven't really seen excessive use of memory in my particular case.I think that many folks with different configurations and with different amounts of extensions will have mileage that varies, and it does make it hard to sort out what is FF and what is Extension related memory use.Let's just leave it at that. If we can't stay on topic and keep away from personal attacks, this topic will be closed.Thanks for helping us to keep on topic and be kind in our responses. OK?

[Keegan]

hm tried opening firefox in safe mode aka no extensions running and then open 5 tabs = firefox is using 93 mbthen close all the tabs but one = firefox is using 62mbif you are seing 32mb with 5 tabs open then i think we are talking about different browsers :Pedit:strange tried the same with "normal" setup then firefox reaches only 62 mb and doesn't release any memory when droping the other tabs

Edited February 17, 2006 by Keegan

[Tushman]

Let's just leave it at that. If we can't stay on topic and keep away from personal attacks, this topic will be closed.Thanks for helping us to keep on topic and be kind in our responses. OK?

I don't have any problems keeping on topic. What I do have a problem with is when people start to fabricate their own interpretations and twisted version of my posts and then say I called then names. How pathetic.

[Guest LilBambi]

Nope...Mozilla Firefox 1.5.0.1 ... and no problems at all!I would suggest uninstalling and reinstalling.If you tried to upgrade an earlier version (prior to 1.5) to the new 1.5.0.1 instead of uninstalling and then installing fresh, that could be a problem. Don't know. I have been updating all along so can't say.All client computers, I uninstall if they have any version prior to 1.5 before upgrade to 1.5.0.1 and they don't have problems either.In truth, I have never have had any crashes with Firefox 1.5 or 1.5.0.1

[Keegan]

Nope...Mozilla Firefox 1.5.0.1 ... and no problems at all!I would suggest uninstalling and reinstalling.If you tried to upgrade an earlier version (prior to 1.5) to the new 1.5.0.1 instead of uninstalling and then installing fresh, that could be a problem. Don't know. I have been updating all along so can't say.All client computers, I uninstall if they have any version prior to 1.5 before upgrade to 1.5.0.1 and they don't have problems either.In truth, I have never have had any crashes with Firefox 1.5 or 1.5.0.1

tried to uninstall and then reinstall, didn't make any difference, oh wellnever had firefox crash on me either not on xp and not on win98sei think this is going 2 improve on later versions anyway, so let's see how 1.5.0.2 is going 2 behave when it comes out in aprilthanx 2 all who contributed in a positive manner this is a great forum:)

[b2cm]

What I do have a problem with is when people start to fabricate their own interpretations and twisted version of my posts and then say I called then names. How pathetic.

I think he was referring to this:

What I find a bit pathetically ridiculous is how some people are jumping on the bandwagon of bashing Firefox for these "memory leaks". The majority of these users represent nothing more than your typical average home user who have no computer/ programming knowledge and yet feel good about bashing FF, just because it's 'fashionable' and every is DOING IT.

It does not call anyone names but what derogatory word can one use to say someone is pathetic, ridiculous, ignorant, pretentious? You did not intend the insult, but the insult is in your speech. It invites a counterattack, this: "refrain from calling people names in this forum (because substituting the person for the argument is incorrect reasoning) but this "we are a little more mature than that" is an insult (childish, malicious). The way it always is: insult begets insult.

and what do ie or opera have with memory problems in firefox?

Nothing. So using Opera or IE flaws as reasoning in the discussion is a non sequitor. (Also, it appears that Keegan has no plans of switching to IE or Opera, so any reference to those browsers appear off-topic and uninteresting.)

More and more articles and posts are coming out slamming FF quality.

Firefox and Opera are so-called 'alternative' browsers, so you could kind of expect users to be more computer/browser-savvy, demanding, critical and expressive. But the developers, who have and continue to do excellent work, need to listen to user complaints and respond more quickly. These users have a history of bashing (IE) and switching browsers when frustration point has been reached.Personally, I don't mind the 'memory leaks' for as long as Firefox or the operating system does not crash because of it. Of course, if there's a fix for it I would be a happier user.

[Gary]

I have been playing around with Opera 9.0 and it is rather neat. I also have flock and several other browsers that I use. There is no Perfect browser out there as there is no perfect piece of software. Software will always have some bugs especially if it is a browser as nasty people spend all of their time trying to find and exploit these bugs.I do use Firefox 1.5.0.1 as my default browser and will continue to do so. I do not experience any memory problems at all.

[Tushman]

It does not call anyone names but what derogatory word can one use to say someone is pathetic, ridiculous, ignorant, pretentious? You did not intend the insult, but the insult is in your speech. It invites a counterattack, this: "refrain from calling people names in this forum (because substituting the person for the argument is incorrect reasoning) but this "we are a little more mature than that" is an insult (childish, malicious). The way it always is: insult begets insult.

I don't agree with your interpretation. Your reasoning that I somehow provoked Keegan to post a counterattack is off base. It's beyond the ridiculous to attempt explaining myself to a person with a 5-yr old mentality (read Keegan) what I said and what I didnt' say. So far, Keegan is the only one on his high & mighty horse claiming that I called him names. It's interesting how in a PM he sent me, he called me a troll. If that's not the definition of a hypocrite, I don't know what is. That's what you get when you get a kid who can't take any opposing viewpoint and has to go running to Mommy and Daddy about getting his feeling hurt.What I find even more disappointing is Bambi's reaction to this whole thread. Instead of dealing w/ the incident forthrightly, the reaction is more of "Oh no no, we don't have disagreements here. Please let this thread die." I don't deal with the ostrich head in the sand mentality. If there is a problem you fix it. But you don't fix it by sweeping it under the rug and pretending like it never happened. Edited February 19, 2006 by Tushman

[Jeber]

Further off-topic posts will be removed.Further posts containing comments about other members will be deleted.Do not reply to this post within this thread. You may PM or email a moderator or administrator if you have questions or comments.

[b2cm]

(snaps to attention and executes hand salute) Yes! Sir!