Jump to content


win 7 - xp mode - not so much...


  • Please log in to reply
13 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   Temmu

Temmu

    The Assimilator

  • Forum MVP
  • 11,873 posts

Posted 09 March 2012 - 05:15 PM

greets!

i guess win 7's xp mode gets a "nice try" for microsoft.  there's stuff that won't run on it that does run on a dedicated xp install.  that's because win 7 xp mode is =virtual= and just misses the mark.  i'm sure loads of stuff that doesn't run on win 7 does on its xp, but that xp is virtual, so, for example, does not have a "real" network card. and that makes some apps fail that need that real card.

anyone want to list a program they have that does not run in win 7 xp mode?

Posted Image

#2 OFFLINE   crp

crp

    Board Bigwig

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,607 posts

Posted 11 March 2012 - 01:59 AM

the more i read and view, the more I am getting the same impression that FireFox explicitly stated:
microsoft to business users: go away , we don't want you.


ps: what do computer companies expect content creators to use? Linux just might make it as the desktop OS after all.
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. ~C. S. Lewis

#3 OFFLINE   Tushman

Tushman

    Forum Fiend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,804 posts

Posted 11 March 2012 - 11:45 AM

QUOTE (crp @ Mar 11 2012, 12:59 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
the more i read and view, the more I am getting the same impression


Based on your own admission that you have no 1st hand experience with this feature in Windows 7, you are going to dismiss Windows desktop OS out of hand?  You have no idea what particular app that Temmu is talking about and yet you think just because one feature doesn't "work right" - the entire fate of Windows desktop is at risk.


QUOTE (crp @ Mar 11 2012, 12:59 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
FireFox explicitly stated:
microsoft to business users: go away , we don't want you.


Is that a dialogue going on inside your head or can you point to a credible source of information?

Since you claim that it's been "explicitly stated" before, there must be a trace of it somewhere on the interwebz.  It's funny how I can find a single trace of it on Mozilla's website.

QUOTE (crp @ Mar 11 2012, 12:59 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Linux just might make it as the desktop OS after all.


I've heard that before.  Since 1986 maybe?  Don't worry - I'll give you another 20 years to catch up and then we can talk about that elusive Linux market penetration.

#4 OFFLINE   Tushman

Tushman

    Forum Fiend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,804 posts

Posted 11 March 2012 - 11:48 AM

QUOTE (Temmu @ Mar 9 2012, 04:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
greets!

i guess win 7's xp mode gets a "nice try" for microsoft.  there's stuff that won't run on it that does run on a dedicated xp install.  that's because win 7 xp mode is =virtual= and just misses the mark.  i'm sure loads of stuff that doesn't run on win 7 does on its xp, but that xp is virtual, so, for example, does not have a "real" network card. and that makes some apps fail that need that real card.

anyone want to list a program they have that does not run in win 7 xp mode?


For the vast majority of applications that run fine in Windows XP, it should run fine in Vista also.  Have you tried running the "stuff" in Vista mode?  Whatever the "stuff" might be since you haven't told us anything in your OP.

If you've tried this and have no luck, have you checked on the vendor's website to see if they have a patch or an update available for your application?

If you've explored / tried both options, then I would suggest try running the application in Windows Virtual PC.

Edited by Tushman, 11 March 2012 - 11:49 AM.


#5 OFFLINE   crp

crp

    Board Bigwig

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,607 posts

Posted 12 March 2012 - 02:48 PM

QUOTE (crp @ Mar 10 2012, 10:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
the more i read and view, the more I am getting the same impression that FireFox explicitly stated:
microsoft to business users: go away , we don't want you.


ps: what do computer companies expect content creators to use? Linux just might make it as the desktop OS after all.

WOOPS   pinch.gif  I misread the OP. I had Win8 so much on my mind I read the original as Win8 and not Windows7.

The biggest problem we have had so far in Windows7 is with a 32bit DOS application which uses a runtime COBOL and with a phone software from MXIE that won't allow saving of messages to a network drive. The XP mode did ok with the DOS application when the XP mode was setup to have its own IP address and not use the IP address from the Win7 host. Actually the issue with using Win7's host IP address caused lots of issues on accessing various LAN items, from both the host and XP mode. It made things much smoother to run the XP mode with it's own IP address and name.

I have not tried the MXIE program under XP mode yet.

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. ~C. S. Lewis

#6 OFFLINE   goretsky

goretsky

    Forum Fiend

  • Forum Moderators
  • 1,546 posts

Posted 13 March 2012 - 03:03 AM

Hello,

Is the 32-bit DOS application an actual program for MS-DOS that uses a 32-bit extender, or a regular 32-bit Windows application that just happens to use a text mode console for its interface?  If the former, I would suggest that you try running it under another emulator, like BOCHS or QEMU.  For the latter, I would suggest checking with the developer to see what their plans are to update it; it could be that they already have a Windows 8 compatible version for you to help them test with.

For the Zultys MXIE application, I would suggest checking with Zultys directly.  Likely, there is an issue with the TAPI interface, but I'm sure one of their support engineers can help solve the problem, or at least open a ticket with engineering.

Regards,

Aryeh Goretsky


QUOTE (crp @ Mar 12 2012, 11:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
WOOPS   pinch.gif  I misread the OP. I had Win8 so much on my mind I read the original as Win8 and not Windows7.

The biggest problem we have had so far in Windows7 is with a 32bit DOS application which uses a runtime COBOL and with a phone software from MXIE that won't allow saving of messages to a network drive. The XP mode did ok with the DOS application when the XP mode was setup to have its own IP address and not use the IP address from the Win7 host. Actually the issue with using Win7's host IP address caused lots of issues on accessing various LAN items, from both the host and XP mode. It made things much smoother to run the XP mode with it's own IP address and name.

I have not tried the MXIE program under XP mode yet.


Dexter is a good dog.
Aryeh Goretsky
Microsoft MVP Windows Expert - ITPro
My blog.

#7 OFFLINE   Ed_P

Ed_P

    Discussion Deity

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,066 posts

Posted 13 March 2012 - 09:30 AM

U3 which ran fine under XP and Windows 7 Home 32-bit didn't run on Windows 7 Home 64-bit or Win 7 Home 64-bit's XP mode but runs fine on Win 7 64-bit's Vista mode.  No idea why.

Most Windows 7 compatibility problems are tied to Windows 7 64-bit rather than Windows 7 as a whole.  Unfortunately most pcs sold come with the 64-bit mode OS.

There are also some 32-bit OCX files I've needed to add to my 64-bit OS to get a couple of my old 32-bit apps to work for me.  COMCTL32, COMDLG32, MSACAL70.OCX, GRID32, DSSOCK32 and TABCTL32.  And they need to be registered with REGSVR32.

The only old app that I ended up having to convert to a new app was an old ZDnet PassWordPro from the late 90s.  It worked fine on Windows 7 32-bit but not Windows 7 64-bit.

#8 OFFLINE   Temmu

Temmu

    The Assimilator

  • Forum MVP
  • 11,873 posts

Posted 13 March 2012 - 10:02 AM

hi, tush, plz re-read the last sentence of the first paragraph - the app fails because it does not see a real network card - xp mode obscures it.


and, everyone else:  smile.gif  thx for the comments!  

anyone with other non-running xp apps?
Posted Image

#9 OFFLINE   crp

crp

    Board Bigwig

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,607 posts

Posted 13 March 2012 - 11:24 AM

QUOTE (Temmu @ Mar 13 2012, 07:02 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
hi, tush, plz re-read the last sentence of the first paragraph - the app fails because it does not see a real network card - xp mode obscures it.

There is a setting in the XP configuration that lets you by pass the emulation of the NIC and give the XP mode direct access to the NIC. You will need to provide a unique IP address (DHCP might work) and computer name to the XP mode
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. ~C. S. Lewis

#10 OFFLINE   crp

crp

    Board Bigwig

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,607 posts

Posted 13 March 2012 - 02:41 PM

QUOTE (goretsky @ Mar 13 2012, 12:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hello,

Is the 32-bit DOS application an actual program for MS-DOS that uses a 32-bit extender, or a regular 32-bit Windows application that just happens to use a text mode console for its interface?  If the former, I would suggest that you try running it under another emulator, like BOCHS or QEMU.  For the latter, I would suggest checking with the developer to see what their plans are to update it; it could be that they already have a Windows 8 compatible version for you to help them test with.

For the Zultys MXIE application, I would suggest checking with Zultys directly.  Likely, there is an issue with the TAPI interface, but I'm sure one of their support engineers can help solve the problem, or at least open a ticket with engineering.

Regards,

Aryeh Goretsky
forget to mention running 64 bit Win7. anyway, the XP mode seemed to work for the COBOL runner, which runs via an embedded ashell from cygwin i think. Win7-64 just refuses to run it and the only fix would be to update the *whole* setup for everyone which is just not worth it till we go full in with win7 on all the pcs.
The Zultys MXIE issue is related to user permissions not the functionality of sending/receiivng faxes and IM. but in saving to file there are loads of problems. we skipped over Vista and it is quite likely the same problem was there as well. They don't have a solution and i will fool around with program startup assignment. worse comes to worse, i'll make user an admin for the pc and put my trust in the UAC and the users common sense smile.gif


Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. ~C. S. Lewis

#11 OFFLINE   Temmu

Temmu

    The Assimilator

  • Forum MVP
  • 11,873 posts

Posted 14 March 2012 - 09:02 AM

QUOTE (crp @ Mar 13 2012, 10:24 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
There is a setting in the XP configuration that lets you by pass the emulation of the NIC and give the XP mode direct access to the NIC. You will need to provide a unique IP address (DHCP might work) and computer name to the XP mode


thx!  i will look into that!  thumbsup.gif
Posted Image

#12 OFFLINE   goretsky

goretsky

    Forum Fiend

  • Forum Moderators
  • 1,546 posts

Posted 15 March 2012 - 04:27 AM

Hello,

It sounds like there is a sort of a workaround for the COBOL application, although it does sounds like quite a bit of work if you have to update all employees' workstations.

Do you have an actual ticket open with Zultys on the MXIE issue?  I would think that MXIE would have full support for Microsoft Windows Vista and Windows 7 by now, but I know that VoIP companies tend to move slow on those Windows compatibility bits and pieces.

Regards,

Aryeh Goretsky

QUOTE (crp @ Mar 13 2012, 11:41 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
forget to mention running 64 bit Win7. anyway, the XP mode seemed to work for the COBOL runner, which runs via an embedded ashell from cygwin i think. Win7-64 just refuses to run it and the only fix would be to update the *whole* setup for everyone which is just not worth it till we go full in with win7 on all the PCs.
The Zultys MXIE issue is related to user permissions not the functionality of sending/receiving faxes and IM. but in saving to file there are loads of problems. we skipped over Vista and it is quite likely the same problem was there as well. They don't have a solution and i will fool around with program startup assignment. worse comes to worse, i'll make user an admin for the PC and put my trust in the UAC and the users common sense smile.gif


Dexter is a good dog.
Aryeh Goretsky
Microsoft MVP Windows Expert - ITPro
My blog.

#13 OFFLINE   crp

crp

    Board Bigwig

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,607 posts

Posted 15 March 2012 - 02:38 PM

QUOTE (goretsky @ Mar 15 2012, 01:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hello,
It sounds like there is a sort of a workaround for the COBOL application, although it does sounds like quite a bit of work if you have to update all employees' workstations.
not the workstations , the actual data and forms for the past couple of years plus we would still need to maintain the older data with the older version since the new version is not compatible with the old data structures and forms. And we use the old data all the time. So *major* hassle.
QUOTE (goretsky @ Mar 15 2012, 01:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Do you have an actual ticket open with Zultys on the MXIE issue?  I would think that MXIE would have full support for Microsoft Windows Vista and Windows 7 by now, but I know that VoIP companies tend to move slow on those Windows compatibility bits and pieces.
Regards,
Aryeh Goretsky
we have lots of tickets open with them  rolleyes.gif

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. ~C. S. Lewis

#14 OFFLINE   goretsky

goretsky

    Forum Fiend

  • Forum Moderators
  • 1,546 posts

Posted 17 March 2012 - 04:12 AM

Hello,

Please give them my regards. biggrin.gif

Regards,

Aryeh Goretsky

QUOTE (crp @ Mar 15 2012, 11:38 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
we have lots of tickets open with them  rolleyes.gif

Dexter is a good dog.
Aryeh Goretsky
Microsoft MVP Windows Expert - ITPro
My blog.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users