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Cutting Back


raymac46

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Looking at my VirtualBox installations today, It struck me that my distro farming is really getting out of hand. I have done several test installations lately and ended up with 4 distros installed in Linux VBox and the same number in Windows 10. I mean - do I really need 8 copies of Firefox and Libre Office?

So I've done some serious pruning. I got rid of all my Linux VMs for now. I don't feel the need to tun Linux on Linux for any length of time. And I'm taking a serious look at my Windows VMs.

I've concluded that I am interested in 3 classes of distros:

  1. Debian - I don't need a VM for that as Linux Mint is a good example of what you can do with Debian and I run that as a primary O/S on the rails.
     
  2. RPM - my favorite is Mageia and I can keep up with how it's developing with a Windows VM.
     
  3. Arch - for the sheer joy of Linux. It's what you make of it and it's like driving a stick shift sports car.

As far as DEs go, I can run Plasma in Mageia, Cinnamon in Linux Mint and Xfce in Arch. I know I don't have GNOME or MATE but the GTK universe is well represented by Xfce and Cinnamon.

 

So far I've removed Siduction, LXLE, Debian Stretch and Fedora from Linux VBox and transferred Arch from Linux VBox to Windows. I plan to remove another Siduction, Ubuntu and Manjaro from my Windows VBox. At the end of the day I'll just have two distros to maintain in Windows Vbox - Arch and Mageia. That's until I do some more testing as I'm sure I will - probably should install Slackware again one of these days.

Edited by raymac46
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securitybreach

Well if you are getting bored with Testing, why not try networking various VMs and create some servers, etc. ?

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@Josh I thought about trying a virtual network but I haven't seen any practical reason to do so. You have a real server and I suppose you are hosting your own website or using it for file service .Don't know.

@Eric I did install Slackware many years ago when I was playing around with Vector Linux. I did not have a major problem doing it but at the time I wasn't all that interested in running KDE. May be different with Xfce.

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securitybreach

@Josh I thought about trying a virtual network but I haven't seen any practical reason to do so. You have a real server and I suppose you are hosting your own website or using it for file service .Don't know.

 

Well I am doing it for learning purposes. A little devops.. B)

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I've concluded that I am interested in 3 classes of distros

 

I've kinda settled in with those same "3 classes of distros":

 

1. .deb distros. This includes Debian, still my favorite, but also Ubuntu LTS, which has turned out to be nice to have around, for me.

 

2. Arch. I also have an Antergos installation, but I'm not sure how much longer I'll keep running Antergos. I say that Debian is "still my favorite," but in many ways I actually like Arch just as much, if not more.

 

3. .rpm distros. openSUSE is the only one in this "class" that I'm using these days. I've considered replacing openSUSE with Mageia, but haven't found good enough reasons to do so.

 

All of these are hard drive installations, no VMs.

 

Also, I have an old laptop that I should probably get rid of, or give away. Nothing really runs great on it, so I just use it sometimes to play around with light-weight installations -- currently, MX-15 (yeah, I know, that's kinda outdated now) and BunsenLabs "Hydrogen". Seems like I boot up that laptop maybe once a month, that's about it.

 

And I like having MX and GParted Live sitting around on flash drives -- sometimes they come in handy. Both of those are Debian-based, of course.

 

I keep saying that I'm gonna cut back and maybe run only Debian and Arch, but I really like all of the distros I'm running right now. A friend of mine says that it's only a matter of time before I start messing around with Slackware. Maybe one day.

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@Eric

So here is Slackware 14.2 64 bit installed in VirtualBox. I am still getting some error messages about VboxVideo but it seems to be working OK. I'll have to do a bit more research.

 

Slackware64_zpse6mlfgpe.jpg

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The error I'm getting is

 

VBoxClient: Failed to connect to the VirtualBox kernel service, rc=VERR_ACCESS_DENIED

This shows up as soon as the Xfce full screen desktop appears and it goes away in about 10 seconds. After that Slackware seems to work well. It must be some weird permissions thing. It was a problem in Ubuntu 16,04 as well.

I assume the way you start Slackware is to log in in TTY1 and then issue the command startx or startxfce4. There is no display manager that I can see.

I built the guest additions modules with no problem - did not try to install virtualbox-guest-utils because i am not familiar with the Slackware package management system.

EDIT: It is some sort of permissions thing. If I log in as root and startx nothing shows up. In any event it doesn't prevent Slackware from running. I have discovered slackpkg and updated the system with it.

Edited by raymac46
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securitybreach

You still see the Windows taskbar when running VB Linux? That's so... not right. ;)

 

Well that is probably because he is not running it fullscreen.

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V.T. Eric Layton

Slackware starts in Run Level 3 by default (multi-user, no X), so you must "startx" via the command line. If you want Slackware to start up in graphic mode with the Xfce login, you can edit the /etc/inittab:

 

# Default runlevel. (Do not set to 0 or 6)
id:3:initdefault:

 

Change the above to:

 

# Default runlevel. (Do not set to 0 or 6)
id:4:initdefault:

 

From Slackware Documentation Project:

 

Graphical Login

 

 

To start with a graphical login screen on boot instead of Slackware's default console login, change the default runlevel to 4. Edit the file /etc/inittab and change the line that looks like

 

id:3:initdefault:

 

to

 

id:4:initdefault:

 

Note the difference from other Linux distributions; many of those use runlevel 5 for their graphical login. In Slackware, runlevel 5 is identical to runlevel 3 (console boot).

 

In the graphical runlevel, you will be greeted by one of the available display (login session) managers. Slackware will by default look for the availability of GDM (Gnome Display Manager), KDM (KDE Display Manager) and XDM (X Display Manager) - in that order. You can also install a third-party login manager like SliM but you will have to edit /etc/rc.d/rc.4 and add a call to your new session manager all the way at the top.

 

Have fun!

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Thanks Eric I discovered the runlevel trick last night and did get a graphical login screen.

However I have found so far that Slackware and its cousin Salix aren't as VirtualBox friendly as some other distros. You wouldn't run into these issues because you install on the rails. Both Slackware and Salix work fine in VBox at low res but when you try to install the guest additions you get errors. Slackware will run full screen after complaining about rc permissions but Salix won't allow you to modprobe vboxadd so you never get a full screen (format errors apparently.) The guest additions build with no problem until you get kernel handling errors.

That said I had no problems installing either distro in VBox without the additions. Very much as I remembered - use cfdisk or Gparted to set up your partitions and away you go.

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SlackKDE_zpscwvsqewr.jpg

 

Well,duh. I think my problem with Slackware in VBox might have been one of two things:

  1. I downloaded the 32 bit version of Slackware instead of the 64 bit version. That might have given some issues with a 64 bit VBox (although it ran OK without the Guest Additions.)
     
  2. I did not install KDE and maybe KDE works better in VBox with Slack. I did not get any error messages and I got this beautiful full screen desktop as soon as the Guest Additions were built.

So Slackware 14.2 works just fine if you are not a dummy.

Edited by raymac46
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Slackware64XFCE_zpsfovqagfq.jpg

 

A bit more testing and I can confirm that using a 64 bit distro in a 64 bit Virtual Machine isn't a bad idea. :w00t:

Xfce works just fine on Slackware now. No permission errors - just comes up full screen.

So as usual many Linux problems occur between the chair and the keyboard. :wacko2: :Laughing:

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So at the end of the day I have gone from distro farming to distro hobby farming I guess.

What I'm keeping:

  1. Linux Mint - on the rails. I recommend and install it for new users. It's easy for Windows users to run. Cinnamon is a great desktop and LM does it best. Plus I get all the Debian tools I like.
     
  2. Mageia - VBox. A great distro and I realized how much I missed it when I installed it again. Best set of GUI control tools in the business. I am using Mageia 6 -. KDE desktop.
     
  3. Arch - VBox. He'll have FUN FUN FUN till his daddy takes the pacman away. Xfce all the way.
     
  4. Slackware - VBox. Stable, fast, nostalgic. Takes me back to my Vector Linux days on the old Compaq laptop - but better. KDE and Xfce.

Edited by raymac46
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Hedon James

In looking at my backup drive archives, I literally have dozens, if not at least 100 VMs that I have created over the years. Interestingly enough, I usually don't stray too far from the Ubuntu/Debian family, although there's a Fedora, an OpenSUSE, and a Mandriva VM in there; although lately "source" distros have become more interesting to me. I used to do it because I could, and I would often discover some unique or interesting implementation that wasn't presented or obvious from the Ubuntu/Debian perspective. When that happens, I try to steal the idea and implement in my bare-metal installation (Lubuntu based these days).

 

I have cut back tremendously also, but it wasn't a conscious decision. I used to install indiscriminately and see if there was anything interesting; nowadays I only install if I consider it interesting. Inasmuch as Gnome, KDE, and XFCE are mostly "standard" fare in the Linux ecosystem, I find them kind of boring. I like "out of the norm", where the distro does something in a new or interesting way, or is unfamiliar to me. This seems like a good way, IMO, to keep informed of new features/ideas without getting bogged down in the mundane of the familiar. A new icon set or customized theme for a distro is meh.....while a new desktop environment, window manager, unique default programs, etc... are interesting.

 

Some current crops in the farm that I consider to be "keepers" for awhile:

 

Arch - source based; still new to me; starting to understand the appeal, but still considering whether it's a fit for me

Manjaro - see Arch; Manjaro is to Arch as Ubuntu is to Debian

AntiX - probably the best all-around lightweight distro

AryaLinux - source-based; probably what Gentoo was in an earlier snapshot; NOT ready for primetime

TrueOS - flagship BSD distro for the Lumina desktop, also available in Linux

PCLOS - rolling release Debian-based, with APT package management, but RPM packages; WHAT? but I like it!

Sabayon - Gentoo-based, but user-friendly GUI (interesting Trivia...Google's Chromium OS is loosely forked from Gentoo, using the Portage package manager!)

Ubuntu Mate - I cut my teeth in Ubuntu using the Gnome2 desktop, and Ubuntu Mate provides this in a fully-compatible GTK3 toolkit; added bonus, their Mutiny desktop is one of only 2 distros besides Ubuntu to provide the Unity desktop, with the second being Makulu

Makulu - Unity desktop was implemented; also, interesting LxFCE hybrid distro (recently retired & archived)

LXLE - heavily customized Lubuntu spin; probably the flagship distro for LXDE desktop implementation, IMO

Porteus - I haven't tinkered with this much, but I keep hearing about it; one of these days I'll dive deeper....

Solus - creators of the Budgie desktop, which seems to be attempting to recreate the ChromiumOS desktop on a Linux distro. considering Chromium's limitations, I wonder if it will capture disgruntled Chromium users?

 

 

I'll probably add more, as future offerings catch my interest. And as I lose interest, I'll archive & retire them. It's all good!

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I have not yet given up the concept of installing and testing new distros. I am keeping my Linux VBox installation for that very purpose. The 3 I have installed in Windows are my Linux Tamagotchis - I'll try to keep them up to date and healthy.

I agree with HJ that it is more interesting to get down and dirty with the source or foundational distros - the ones that define a category. So it was that I started with Manjaro and ended up with Arch. Started with Vector Linux and ended up with Slackware. I like Debian a lot, but most of what I see there I can do with Mint or one of the 'buntus. Everyone should try a Debian net install once, though.

Gentoo - well haven't got there yet but in a Virtual Machine you shouldn't worry if you bork it.

So far nothing has taught me more about the basics of Linux than Arch, nor has given me more satisfaction than working my way through an Arch install and having it work at each successive stage of the process - disk configuration, basic system install, boot to CLI, get X working, add the Guest Additions and display manager, choose your DE and software.

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V.T. Eric Layton

Initially, when I first came to Linux, and after my fear of the unknown, I decided to try all of the Main Line distros (the old ones that are ancestors of all the distros out there these days).

 

They are (those still actively maintained):

  • Debian
  • Slackware
  • Puppy
  • Gentoo
  • Crux
  • Ark
  • Redhat

Linux_Distro_Timeline.png

 

My first attempt was Debian 3.15 (Sarge). The Ncurses installer scared the bee-jeebus out of me. I still remember loading up that ISO disk on my old AMD K7 machine and freaking out when that installer started up.

 

Next came Slackware. Hmmph! And I thought Debian was scary. :ermm:

 

Later, I installed Crux (Arch's grand dad), Ark (a very nice distro, actually), and CentOS (the opensource version of RedHat).

 

I played around with Puppy a bit, but never installed (built) Gentoo. You really have to be a self-flagellating masochist to build and run that distro. Although, I know that most who go through all the trouble to build and install Gentoo become HARDCORE Gentoo fans after that. I've just never got that far... maybe someday.

 

After I farmed the above, I branched off to the branches, so to speak... SuSE, Arch, Foresight, numerous Slackware derivatives (Zenwalk, Vector, Salix, Wolvix, SLAX, Porteus, etc.), Mandriva, PCLinuxOS, Fedora, and so on.

 

My favorites to this day are:

  1. Slackware (of course :w00t: )

    1. Zenwalk
    2. Salix
    3. [*]Debian

      1. Mint
      2. Mepis
      3. Ubuntu (Xubuntu)

      [*]CentOS

      [*]Arch

      [*]OpenSuSE

      [*]Fedora

      Ah... fun times! :bounce:

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I think that just as Vector Linux gave me the courage to get into Slackware - maybe Sabayon would be the entry point into a Gentoo type of experience. However I don't want to spend days compiling a distro in VirtualBox.

If I screw up Arch I have Josh here to bail me out. Is there anyone who is a Gentoo guru here?

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V.T. Eric Layton

We had a Gentoo guru here for years, trigggl (Greg), but he hasn't logged in here since 2014. :( Hope all is well in his world. Greg was a good guy.

 

I actually tried Sabayon once. I don't remember precisely what happened, but I faintly remember it as a not-so-good experience.

 

Oh, and Vector is Okee-dokee as far as Slackware derivatives go, but if you really want to be impressed, try Salix and Zenwalk.

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I ran Sabayon here for awhile (with KDE). Kept with it for almost two years (according to my notes), starting with Sabayon 9. Not sure how close it is to Gentoo, which I've never run. Ran into some problems with Sabayon 13.04, then gave up on it. I think they switched to using systemd with 13.08. I did like their equo package management tool -- it was interesting -- except I thought it was kinda slow.

 

Any distro I install, I'm trying to see how things go over the long term. Like maybe for a couple of years or so.

 

Sabayon's a rolling-release distro, but there were a couple of times where things broke down for me and I had to reinstall (maybe I wasn't smart enough to figure out how to fix things without reinstalling). Not like what I've experienced with Arch. Arch has been the most stable rolling-release distro I've used, over the long term, and I think it kinda killed my interest in Sabayon.

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Yeah I'm an enthusiast - up to a point. I read a bit about Gentoo - it seems it takes multicore processors like an FX-8350 or an i7 desktop a full day to compile a desktop distro. Might be OK for a server or CLI distro if you don't want a GUI.

Add to that I'm working in VBox with limited memory and fewer cores and it wouldn't be fun. Also in VBox there is a good chance something wouldn't work right and I'd need to reinstall - so another day of number crunching.

Whenever I've tried a derivative of a Main Line distro I have been eventually inspired to go for the real deal - and I don't think I want to go down that road with Gentoo. For now there's still a lot to learn from Arch and Slackware.

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securitybreach

That and the results of compiling everything specific to your hardware is an overkill with today's hardware. I am not going to compile chrome for 4 hours just to get a 1% bump in performance. The amount of time to install an application is just not worth the results on Gentoo. At that point, you may as well run LFS (Linux From Scratch).

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Whenever I've tried a derivative of a Main Line distro I have been eventually inspired to go for the real deal

 

That hasn't always been the case here. Sometimes, running the derivative has convinced me that I didn't want to try the parent.

Edited by saturnian
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Well my experience with Arya Linux so far hasn't inspired me to try Linux From Scratch, it's true.

Edited by raymac46
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Lots of fun with Arch Linux in VBox. I figured out how to configure LightDM and have a wallpaper background like the desktop, then installed the Numix theme for Xfce. I think it looks nicer than the Adwaita default theme.

 

Numix_zpsdan7n1gh.jpg

Edited by raymac46
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securitybreach

Lots of fun with Arch Linux in VBox. I figured out how to configure LightDM and have a wallpaper background like the desktop, then installed the Numix theme for Xfce. I think it looks nicer than the Adwaita default theme.

 

Numix_zpsdan7n1gh.jpg

 

Looks great (besides the Window's part ;)) :thumbsup:

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