Prelude76 Posted April 28, 2003 Share Posted April 28, 2003 I currently use WindowsXP (for internet & work related apps) and Windows98SE for gaming. Linux does intrigue me, and I'll soon get around to installing it and trying it out, but I have some questions for the Linux community.What do you do on Linux?For office applications, I use MS Office XP. Do I have to learn to use Star Office to get by on Linux?For graphics, I use Fireworks and PaintShopPro and ACDSee. Do I have to learn Gimp, and how does it compare?For web design, I use Dreamweaver. Is there an equivalent in Linux?I get my computer checked with Norton AV, use NewsGrabber for newsgroups, use Webshots for calendar/screensaver/desktop picture, use ZoneAlarm for firewall, and for R&R, I play maybe Windows-based games. Can I use any of these that I currently use?I'm not bashing Linux, and I know theirs Windows emulators out there. Are they any good? Do you still need Windows loaded? If so, how can Linux hope to replace Windows on desktops if it also means re-learning many applications we all use and love? The only real way I see is if every decent company starts making Linux versions, right? How can that happen?I'll probably install and love Linux, but just wondering about what happens to all the applications that make a computer 'useful'. An OS only takes it so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjf123 Posted April 28, 2003 Share Posted April 28, 2003 ... how can Linux hope to replace Windows on desktops if it also means re-learning many applications we all use and love?...I'm also a Windows (and Mac) user who is thinking of adding Linux to my Win98 box. I've got the same questions. While Linux might be a "better" OS, I don't see it making big inroads as a desktop OS for the majority of users. Most home users use their PC for e-mail, word processing, web browsing, home finances, games, etc. Doing the e-mail, word processing, and web browsing is easy under Linux. Is there a Linux equivalent for Quicken, MS Money, Turbo Tax, QuickBooks, etc? Not that I'm aware of. Until that happens, I think Linux will remain stuck with the traditional computer geek (including me).The same problems exist for getting businesses to switch over. If you're a large company with hundreds of users who are familiar, and proficient, with Excel, Word, and Access, and have thousands of spreadsheets and documents created with those apps, how easy will it be to switch everyone over to Star Office or Open Office. The cost of the lost productivity would be staggering. After the changeover is completed, there would be real savings, but with most public companies only being concerned about next quarter's profits, they won't be likely to spend the time and money to make the change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhbell Posted April 28, 2003 Share Posted April 28, 2003 I currently use WindowsXP (for internet & work related apps) and Windows98SE for gaming. Linux does intrigue me, and I'll soon get around to installing it and trying it out, but I have some questions for the Linux community.What do you do on Linux?For office applications, I use MS Office XP. Do I have to learn to use Star Office to get by on Linux?For graphics, I use Fireworks and PaintShopPro and ACDSee. Do I have to learn Gimp, and how does it compare?For web design, I use Dreamweaver. Is there an equivalent in Linux?I get my computer checked with Norton AV, use NewsGrabber for newsgroups, use Webshots for calendar/screensaver/desktop picture, use ZoneAlarm for firewall, and for R&R, I play maybe Windows-based games. Can I use any of these that I currently use?I'm not bashing Linux, and I know theirs Windows emulators out there. Are they any good? Do you still need Windows loaded? If so, how can Linux hope to replace Windows on desktops if it also means re-learning many applications we all use and love? The only real way I see is if every decent company starts making Linux versions, right? How can that happen?I'll probably install and love Linux, but just wondering about what happens to all the applications that make a computer 'useful'. An OS only takes it so far. I will let others explain the pros and cons of Linux vs Windows. As a PC Consultant I use both Windows and Linux. As soon as I am more proficient and comfortable with Linux, I will switch my Home office and all of my computers over to Linux. The most compelling reason for this is an article on Microsoft which can be found at the below URL. MH \( http://www.aaxnet.com/editor/edit029.html#mspath ) It is a long article But well worth the time to read it. You will be shocked when you learn how ruthless Microsoft really is and what they are doing to the unsuspecting public. The Spy ware, EULA’s (end user license agreements), NDA’s (non disclosure agreements), Extortion of the Computer Industry, Coercion of the Software and Computer Manufacturer’s. I urge you to please read the above article. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prelude76 Posted April 28, 2003 Author Share Posted April 28, 2003 i'd be the first to agree that M$ is evil. that is why I choose to use a corp key instead of doing the legit thing and purchasing XP so i can be spied on with their WPA. i believe in supporting worthwile software, but I will not be forced to pay $200 for the privilige to use an OS.I try to stay away from evil corporations, and have switch to TaxWiz instead of Quicken's QuickTax because of their highly intrusive and restrictive Authorization. I switched because I had a choice; TaxWiz has a simple registration and does not lock in to my hard drive's serial number. But in terms of OS choice, we really dont have a choice. Thats my question. how can people simply switch to Linux without losing all their favorite games, applications, etc... ? If linux can tackle that, then i will be a real competition to** But i'm reluctant to switch to Linux and then do what? just us it for email, web browsing, and re-learning their office and graphics products? and what if i want to play the latest game? switch back to Windows? is there a tax program for linux? what about dreamweaver? those are the questions i'm after. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quint Posted April 28, 2003 Share Posted April 28, 2003 mhbell1,Thanks for the most interesting link; looks like MS wants total control - literally.Prelude76,There are alternative applications to just about all the ones you mentioned, and if not, there are Linux versions of them. For example:Quick Tax = GnuCashDreamweaver = WebSphere MQ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peachy Posted April 28, 2003 Share Posted April 28, 2003 There are many missing pieces to the Linux puzzle/conundrum (namely application software for many home office functions). I would suspect that software developers may start writing Linux apps when the user base of installed Linux systems surpasses that of the Mac. There are no readily available apps on the Linux platform to rival that of Macromedia, save ColdFusion MX. The other thing that Linux users must face is that they can't expect commerical developers to give away their software and stay in business. Whether the big commercial developers are willing to GNU PL the source code is a seperate issue. I'm all for Linux apps that I could buy like Dreamweaver MX for Linux. That being said, what's wrong with trying to see if your Windows apps runs using Wine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjf123 Posted April 28, 2003 Share Posted April 28, 2003 I urge you to please read the above article. You're right. That is a long article, most of which I was already aware. Those are exactly the reasons why I recently purchased a Mac, and am interested in Linux. I don't like the direction MS is heading. Having said that, there are still apps that I can only run on my Win box. I'm not familiar with WINE. Is that a Linux equivalent of Virtual PC for the Mac, which lets you run Windows programs on the Mac? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prelude76 Posted April 28, 2003 Author Share Posted April 28, 2003 i looked into WINE for Linux. It's the sort of direction that i'd love to see Linux go into. I read their website, and though they have a growing list of supported applications that it supports in Linux, it's still not there yet. Read their Dreamweaver entry, and as one person reported, "I got it to install successfully under Linux but it still won't run". so, what're you're saying is Dreamweaver won't run in Linux isnt there another windows emulator, that runs Windows inside a Linux window environment, running Windows code to run windows applications? Whats the name of it? It looks like WINE attempts to make Windows apps run directly in Linux, with limited success. they only list a dozen programs that run flawlessly.And what is Lindows? is it an add=on to Linux, or a seperate distro? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quint Posted April 28, 2003 Share Posted April 28, 2003 isnt there another windows emulator, that runs Windows inside a Linux window environment, running Windows code to run windows applications?Is this what you mean:Cygwin http://www.cygwin.com/ (free) , Dragonlinux http://dragonlinux.sourceforge.net/ (free), and Winlinux 2000 http://www.winlinux.net/2003/or am I misunderstanding...again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prelude76 Posted April 28, 2003 Author Share Posted April 28, 2003 Cygwin, that's the name I heard of before. Thanks. Anyone use it? If so, does it run, say, 90% of windows apps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peachy Posted April 28, 2003 Share Posted April 28, 2003 Cygwin, that's the name I heard of before. Thanks. Anyone use it? If so, does it run, say, 90% of windows apps?Actually, Cygwin is a dll for Windows that allows you to run Linux/Unix apps in Windows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Posted April 28, 2003 Share Posted April 28, 2003 Gosh, there is a whole discussion going on here. . . . and I nearly missed it Prelude76, on your first post: I have a windows computer tucked away somewhere but hardly touch it, I can do everything I want on Linux. Take in account that I am no gamer, so that part does not bother me, ( I was surprised though, reading that they were converting Linux games for windows, Tux-racer ). I'm more a tweaker, and tweakers have all the fun with Linux ! I use OpenOffice for doc's and spreadsheets, am very comfortable with The Gimp in stead of PaintShopPro and am delighted about the firewall capabilities Linux offers. Emulators are out of the question, this box doesn't even have, never had, any trace of windows on it. I am convinced that if one looks around one will find Linux applications for every job that needs to be done. For example: I like electronic music and making it myself, Linux has so many different programs for it that I will never have enough time to discover/master them all, sheer heaven. Do I miss windows ?? Well have a guess ! I do a lot of troubleshooting on the windows PC's of my friends, and every time I get home and boot my own box, I thank heaven on my bare knees I made the switch to Linux ! BrunoPS:One more thing, there are several people on this forum who recently made the switch to Linux. All of those seem to have a good time with it. If you and bjf123 decide to join the happy-ones: welcome to the club, we will all try to make you feel at home and keep your system in good shape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LilBambi Posted April 28, 2003 Share Posted April 28, 2003 Me too Bruno ... just found this thread myself ---I have been keeping a close eye on this whole subject ... it is one I am really wrestling with myself.I make use of whatever tool does the job for me in a given area, and right now that means having both Windows and Linux desktops that I run all the time connected by a KVM switch.There are many things that I do in Linux, and many things that I do in Windows.In the search for ways to run Windows and/or at least some Windows programs (quite a few actually) on Linux, I have found the following information. There is much more out there.And running Windows on Linux is by no stretch of the imagination the only way to go.The following ZDNet|UK article indicates that OfficeXP can now be run on Linux using CrossOver Office ... with a caveat ... "If there is an issue that's reproducible on Windows then we will help to resolve it but if the issue only exists when you're running Office with CrossOver on Linux, then that's a problem with their implementation and we're not going to resolve it -- it would be up to them," said Wilkinson. http://news.zdnet.co.uk/story/0,,t285-s2133812,00.htmlCrossOver Office is aimed at making Linux a more viable alternative to Windows by allowing it to run familiar Windows applications. Besides Office XP, the software supports popular software such as Adobe Photoshop, Lotus Notes and Intuit's Quicken.Sorry, no Dreamweaver yet .... oh, well Also, no dancing just yet, there are limitations, as noted in this article from ZDNet|UK:http://news.zdnet.co.uk/story/0,,t285-s2133785,00.htmlCodeWeavers' CrossOver Office now supports the full Office XP suite, with the exception of Outlook XP and Access XP. Outlook 2000 and Access 2000 are supported. The package plugs in to the standard Gnome or KDE desktops for Linux and Unix.However, if you can use Evolution (which is very close to what Outlook offers, and a Linux based database program, or Access 2000 (see article below), this might just be enough to keep you in business and still be able to use Microsoft Office XP on Linux.Other options for running Windows on Linux:VMWareWin4Lin(neither one is free)And of course there is Wine itself:http://www.winehq.com/Wine is an Open Source implementation of the Windows API on top of X and Unix. (developer: Codeweavers, who is also developing Crossover as a commercial product)See this interesting article about the new release of both Wine 3.0 and Crossover Office 2.0 which includes Office XP, Access 2000, and Photoshop 7:http://www.winehq.com/index.php?issue=167#News: CrossOver Office 2.0, MS Threatens DeveloperThere are reviews links at the above article as well as a reference to the ZDNet|UK article I had found previously. Although M$ will not support it fully, Codeweavers says they will.There is much going on in this area. I will definitely be keeping an eye on things ... things are progressing nicely for Linux I have found many programs that I really like better in Linux and others I just can't do without.Would still love to see Dreamweaver and a few other Windows programs actually ported to Linux, but I guess, all in good time ... I have patience, and it is looking like patience may just start paying off. We shall see Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonicDragon Posted April 29, 2003 Share Posted April 29, 2003 I've been thinking about linux for a long time now. As for right now, there is no real reason for me to switch. I'm very confortable with XP and know most of the ins and outs of windows. It's the whole thought of duel booting that scares me away. I just don't want to deal with that. But, as soon as i can get my hands on another pc, linux is going right on it!! I would really like to get into linux. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonicDragon Posted April 29, 2003 Share Posted April 29, 2003 BTW, THanks for the great article! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prelude76 Posted April 29, 2003 Author Share Posted April 29, 2003 thanks y'all for the help. been reading about Wine and Cross Over and its reassuring which directions they're heading. I might wait a few more months so more applications are supported. At least Dreamweaver. or i'll load up a plain Linux version just to try out. Maybe i'm scared. If i go linux, will i ever go back? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Posted April 29, 2003 Share Posted April 29, 2003 Try Knoppix, no HD install, runs from CD, so you can have a taste of Linux, see this thread:http://www.scotsnewsletter.com/forums/inde...t=ST&f=14&t=294But be careful, because you're right, you may never want to go back Bruno Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henderrob Posted May 1, 2003 Share Posted May 1, 2003 I figure that I'll try Linux and learn it's ins and outs because Windows is just getting to expensive. I find that Mandrake 9.1 using KDE desktop gives me all I need anyways. Retail USD39. Windows Home USD199.To me the math counts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imranj Posted May 3, 2003 Share Posted May 3, 2003 Seeing the reply flying around...............shutting windows totally is out of the question.............linux is ready ..........but not so ready that i can format c:\ and turn it up to ......../dev/hda..........u know my sis i asked her to use linux redhat.......for few days she got so pissed of that she started litterly banging her head on the monitorand was begging me to get xp on it.......and Ms word too..........although she did apreicate linux's stability.......... <_<any comments welcome..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zox Posted May 3, 2003 Share Posted May 3, 2003 .for few days she got so pissed of that she started litterly banging her head on the monitorand was begging me to get xp on it.......and Ms word too..........although she did apreicate linux's stability......One more reason to ditch Windows, cause you become Win-addict like your sis.Help her, don't let them take your sis forever, fight, for christ sake, ..fight! There is still hope, switch her over to Mandrake or Suse with Wine, Crossover Plugin and Crossover office, that way she still has access to all her favorite apps, icluding MS Word, but in nicely isolated environment surounded with friendly penguins.Over the time she will realize that penguins mean no harm, she will ditch all ties to dark underworld of the Micro$haft and she will be cured. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LilBambi Posted May 3, 2003 Share Posted May 3, 2003 LOL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent007 Posted May 5, 2003 Share Posted May 5, 2003 hi all,There are tonnes of reasons as to why one would enjoy switching to GNU/Linux...(even though a changeover is always difficult). Let me highlight some of the main points:-1) Security:- HIGHLY SECURE!! No need to worry about virri and trojan horses or some malware,spyware, because there will never be any virri. System files will always be intact and can never be deleted accidentally or overwritten by normal users....unlike the 'DLL ****' that Windows Users have to face. Secondly, running of Trojan cleaners, Virrri scanners, Spyware Scanners, Memory Optimizers, Registry Cleaners and a host of other crap is NOT needed and hence u can save precious CPU cycles that can be used for something more worthwhile.2) Choice:- A full-fledged GNU/Linux distribution comes loaded with nothing less than 3CD's filled with 650MB of Apps. U can choose to install whatever u want and ofcourse remove whatever u want without having to go to some site and download stuff....And if u dont like one distro, move on to find another until ur comfortable with it. All a matter of choice! 3) Stability:- Highly stable due to the fact that source code is freely available and there is someone or the other always making a quick bug fix etc. Remember, Security through obscurity never works! So, when one has access to source code, flaws can be fixed with ease. File-system (ext3) is so great that u dont even have to worry about power failures... Running the system for days together won't even require a reboot. Hence, all in all, ZERO maintenance.4) Networking:- Very safe in a networked environment. If working at Home, users can easily set-up a web-server, e-mail server, content filtering, web-caching etc etc...all software comes with the distro.5) GNU/Linux makes optimum use of the hardware..If u can't find a driver for ur piece of hardware (though this is highly unlikely), then pls dont blame GNU/Linux..Catch hold of the hardware manufactures or buy hardware which is more mainstream.6) Sharing:- Last but not the least, u can go about FREELY sharing GNU/Linux software with anyone and everyone WITHOUT having to worry about whether it is a crime. No more having to hunt around for cracks or Key generators..*************************APPLICATIONS THAT I USE*************************GNU/Linux Distro:- RedHat 9.0BootManager:- GRUBDesktop:- Window Maker or IceWMFile Manager:- XWC or MCMultimediaVideo-------> MplayerMP3---> XMMS with crossfade pluin (skins can be used from Winamp2.xx series)MP3 Tagging----> Easy Tagger (very powerful and great interface)CD-Player------> Gnome CD playerRipping to MP3--->LAME, cdparanoia, or GRIP (VBR is g8 for high quality)GraphicsHTML Editor---->Blue FishImage Viewer----> gThumb ( supports thumbnails, bookmarks, etc)Printing of CD-Labels--->GcoverImage Editing-----------> GimpEngineering tool--------> Dia ( cool for layouts )Viewing Images from digital cameras---->GtkamOthers------->kiconedit, kcoloredit, kcolorchooserInternetFTP client------->gFTPPacket Sniffing--->EtherealE-mail Client-----> Evolution (Outlook Clone) or KmailBrowser----------->Galeon, Mozilla, NetscapeInstant Messaging----->GAIMDownloading and Leeching---> wget (man wget for tonnes of options)Word ProcessingOpen Office SuitePDF Viewer----->ggvSystemBurning CD's----->K3B (great interface), or XcdroastWorking with compressed archives---->File-rollerPackage Management (RPM's)---->Apt-get or Red-Hat Package ManagerOther system tools--->redhat-config-* (where * is whatever tool u want)A simple script creates a backup of the /home folder, automatically compresses it which I burn later. It's not necessary to backup the whole system, since all ur settings are stored in /home/ur-name. If u ever upgrade ur system, just copy back all the folders to ur account and voila!The future of gaming will be very exciting for GNU/Linux users. The other day, a friend of mine got hold of this game which automatically ran from the CD!! Just like Knoppix...No need to install etc. And believe it or not, we got a higher frame rate as compared to Windows. After playing, the CD was ejected and system was powered off. The HDD was never used, unless ofcourse if u wanna save. If ur an avid gamer, then install Win98SE and keep it for games only. Try to migrate ur other stuff to GNU/Linux. Join ur GNU/Linux Local User group and share ur experiences etc..U'll be a pro in no time!Guess this is it for now.bye,007 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Posted May 5, 2003 Share Posted May 5, 2003 Agent007, a good contribution to the thread, thanks !Nice to see what programs you are using, good move to post that here. Bruno Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LilBambi Posted May 5, 2003 Share Posted May 5, 2003 Agent007, a good contribution to the thread, thanks !Nice to see what programs you are using, good move to post that here. Â BrunoBruno --You are so right .. great to see what works best for different folks. There are so many options. I use many of the same programs, as I am sure you do as well.Agent007 --Thanks for the contribution to the thread. Many great programs you are using.Two additional things I might also suggest to back up to make life easier.[*] /etc - to make it easier to get system configuration back easily, including firewall settings[*] partition information - make a hard copy of all mount points/names for easier reinstallation.In addition to the multimedia programs that you mentioned, I also use gRIP to rip my CDs, and encoding with the LAME mp3 encoder, although I also really like the OGG encoder. BLADE was very sluggish the last time I used it's encoder.Another package manager that I have used since RedHat 6.x and really like is gnoRPM.Xchat is my choice for connecting to IRC servers; another good one is KVirc. (even though ksirc is easy, it is a pain and has many limitations).Firebird to replace Mozilla Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent007 Posted May 5, 2003 Share Posted May 5, 2003 Thanks guys! Just a small contribution to the great GNU/Linux community....LilBambi,The prob with OGGS is that there r not many players which support OGG media. Dunno if OGG will make it big time like MP3. The name itself sounds a bit funny...but quality is really great...Ur right about the /etc...Forgot to mention that one rgds,007 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Posted May 6, 2003 Share Posted May 6, 2003 007, I´ll follow your example, here is why I use Linux:DISTRO´SMandrake 9.1Debian 3.0 ( Knoppix on HD )Slackware 9.0 ( to replace the 8.1 tomorrow )VectorLinux 3.2MULTIMEDIAVideo --> mplayerogg --> xmmsmp3 --> xmmsCD --> KsCDStreams --> RealPlayer G2Encoder --> LameRecorder --> vsound and krecSequenser --> RosegardenAudioEditor --> AudacitySynthesizer --> AmsynthBasssynth --> FreebirthLoops --> SpyralloopsGRAPHICSImages general/editing --> The GimpIcons --> Gnome Icon editor ( sometimes Gimp )Viewer --> anything that comes up ( Gimp )INTERNETEmail --> EvolutionBrowser --> GaleonDownload --> integrated in GaleonBanking --> KonquerorOFFICEOpenOffice.orgSYSTEMBurning --> k3b / cdcopy ( commandline )ISO´s --> cdrecordEditors --> Vi !! :)Console --> Konsole ( transparent )Monitoring --> GkrellmDocs --> Rute on HDASTRONOMYCelestiaXplnsI fear the list is not complete, but it´s a good start.AND THEY ALL COME FOR ¨FREE¨, AND I CAN TWEAK THEM AS I LIKE !! :) Bruno Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest genaldar Posted May 10, 2003 Share Posted May 10, 2003 First off ms isn't evil. They are a corporation out to make a profit for their shareholders, if that is evil so is coke, sony, redhat, etc. are evil. btw I've never understood why calling it m$ is an insult "in 20 years you turned a garage company into one of the most powerful corporations in the world, and made yourself the richest man in the world. Neener, neener Bill Gates".Secondly linux can't do everything windows (or mac) can. If you are a serious professional artist the gimp cannot replace photoshop (**** it can't replace paintshop pro). There is also nothing as elegant as fireworks or dreamweaver for linux. Sound editing is also a section where linux is lacking. Linux has nothing to match even cool edit pro, let alone pro tools. Also for serious office work openoffice.org (openoffice was an already registered name btw so they can't legally use just it) and star office can't do nearly as much as word or excel. Some of the stuff I've seen done in word is impossible in oo.o and star. oo.o and star also can't do statistics as well as excel (very popular with statitians actually). There also aren't alternatives to some of the most popular apps on the market. The cheap stuff you find for 20 bucks at bestbuy (like geneology software) has no real alternative on linux. And after working a christmas season at a software store let me tell that a lot of our biggest selling stuff is that 20 buck software. It's also a lot of trouble to get video files to play properly.Linux can do most of the stuff a mac or a pc can do, but its not as friendly (ask anyone with a 3d problem, or a modem problem, or a printer problem). It's not that much cheaper (good linux distro is what $70 and an xp upgrade disc is only $100). It's also less compatible. And if (a big if here people, since they need commercial software and more full compatability to succeed) it becomes popular enough there will be virii and trojans for it. Lastly most the linux "community" is a bunch of "rtfm" spouting wanna be guru script kiddies.Don't get me wrong I like linux. And there are great sources of information out there (like this forum). But when you weigh the bad and the good unless you absolutely hate windows and mac (I'd switch to mac long before I'd go full linux) don't expect to get compelling reasons to switch full time. btw the "community"'s shouting m$ is evil does nothing but reinforce my script kiddie comments. Attack ms at its actual weaknesses (of which there are many) but they use the fud they claim to hate. But just like any crowd many in the linux community are hypocrits. "m$ spies on you", no proof to that claim, but there is proof to the claim that real spies on you, yet realplayer is used by many. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greengeek Posted May 10, 2003 Share Posted May 10, 2003 I can't say that I agree with your version of the Linux community. We don't all hate Microsoft and a lot of us are also Window's users. At 55 I really don't think I'm a script kiddie.Joy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cluttermagnet Posted May 10, 2003 Share Posted May 10, 2003 Try Knoppix, no HD install, runs from CD, so you can have a taste of Linux, see this thread:http://www.scotsnewsletter.com/forums/inde...t=ST&f=14&t=294But be careful, because you're right, you may never want to go back  BrunoReceived my Knoppix 3.2 CD in the mail just today. This weekend, my brave new world of Linux begins. I will let y'all know how I'm doing. Lots of good points made and experiences shared in this thread. Mind you, I won't abandon Windows until it truly becomes untenable, and I think that time is still far off. What will happen is a lot of us will not buy the new OS's that they release, or the very new hardware it will take to run it. I bet a lot of us keep our Win98 or XP machines going for a good while. Heck, I still have a perfectly functional 486-66 with Win95 on it, and keep it running for sentimental reasons. As a second backup to my main machine, it is still perfectly capable of surfing and emailing. Less secure, but I'm on dialup and run AV and a firewall.What will be hard to give up is my more capable machines with all that lovely software written for windows. I have Paint Shop. Yeah, I suppose Adobe Photoshop is better, but I am more than impressed with PSP and I at least know how to use that one well. So for all the fabulous software on my Windows machines, I will keep a few older computers running for as long as I possibly can. That does not prevent me from migrating to Linux if it does go that way for me. I figure I still have a few years to get good at it. So I will have both, in that case. Get enough of us using Linux and the software guys will start taking the OS more seriously and the quality will ramp up to more on a par with Windows software.Already my first Linux milestone- Knoppix prefers to boot from the CD but you can make a boot floppy. I figured I would try the floppy, although it is easy to change the boot device order in my BIOS. So I go to copy the boot.img to a 1.44M floppy and no go- the computer keeps saying I need a second floppy. I say different. I finally resort to reading the instructions- LOL- and find out you have to use this little rawrite2.exe to get the software on the CD. D'oh! A minute later I have my boot floppy. I thought it was going to be a little tight, what with the image being 1,474,560 bytes or so according to windows, and the size of my formatted floppy being 1, 447,664. As usual, I am thinking in a Windows way, because lo and behold, that image gets shoehorned into that one floppy somehow! Linux bits must be leaner and in better shape than those lazy, television-watching, remote control using Windows bits!BTW I bought my Knoppix CD on Ebay. LOL! Seriously, if you are stuck on dialup like me, that is the way to go. I paid more for shipping than for the 99 cent CD. I thanked the guy for going to the trouble. He won't get rich selling Linux distros, but he is spreading the word! Fred Langa put me on to this when he wrote in his newsletter about how neat these zero footprint OS's are and that they are even starting to show up on Ebay. So anyway, sometime in the next 36 hours I will let Knoppix try to find all my hardware for the first time and see how it wakes up. Then I will have to see if I can learn to speak Linux. As Maynard G. Krebs used to say on the Dobie Gillis show, "Work?!" Never mind, cadets- that was a little before your time- go back to your gaming and palm pilots, and pay no attention to us geezers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Posted May 10, 2003 Share Posted May 10, 2003 GO for it Cluttermagnet ! Go for it !If you need any help, let us know. Suggestion: Start a new thread about your Knoppix adventures ! Fist try to run it from CD to see if all your hardware is supported, then install it on HD !Have you got all the info you need about the install ? I´ll log in from time to time to see how you´re pulling it of !Success ! Bruno Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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